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10.2.5
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Questions for a Catholic
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I'm giving the sermon on sunday. It will be recorded. Want a copy?
Absolutely.
Just an off-question: what denomination are you?
Post by
MyTie
I'm giving the sermon on sunday. It will be recorded. Want a copy?
Absolutely.
Just an off-question: what denomination are you?
non-denominational
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I haven't actually read anything in this thread, but i'd just like to clarify one thing htat gets screwed up in every wowhead religious debate.
Being religious != agreeing with the heads of church.
Being Catholic does = agreeing with the rightful heads of Church.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Why is it that after Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge, they clothed themselves? Why did they think that nudity was wrong or a sin?
They probably experienced lust for the first time, and I'm guessing it scarred them to death.
Post by
Sagramor
I don't want to derail your thread, so I'll lay off on the joke discussion.
Anyways, if God has infinite Wisdom, shouldn't he able to find a way let us contact him wherever and whenever?
He does: we call it prayer.
Or why didn't he just make it so we could do that already, without having to plunge as deep into his pool of infinite Wisdom?
Adam and Eve talked with God. He did make us that way.
Also, why a church? What is so special about those completely random buildings at completely random locations that makes those the places to connect with God?
Because as humans, certain things help us achieve a better union with God. One of those is community, thus the need for a large area. Another is beauty, hence the...well...beauty. Etc.
Yes, but why do we need to pray at the church? Why can't we just stick to the ones we do at home?
Okay, but why can't we no longer talk to him so directly? Why do we have to go to these places (churches)? I mean, couldn't God have just let us stay with that ability, even after the whole apple incident?
Pretty place, with lots of people and a large area...hmm...what about Central Park? Why is it that people don't just go there and pray and leave? It certainly seems a lot more pleasant than church. Well, than most churches anyways.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Yes, but why do we need to pray at the church? Why can't we just stick to the ones we do at home?
I've said this a couple times now.
Qua
humans, that isn't enough to bring our being fully to God.
Okay, but why can't we no longer talk to him so directly? Why do we have to go to these places (churches)? I mean, couldn't God have just let us stay with that ability, even after the whole apple incident?
Again, you're point at faults in God that don't exist. We turned away from God. It's like loosing your virginity...nothing you can do will make you innocent again.
Pretty place, with lots of people and a large area...hmm...what about Central Park? Why is it that people don't just go there and pray and leave? It certainly seems a lot more pleasant than church. Well, than most churches anyways.
I've been to many, many masses up in the mountains and in nature and it's absolutely beautiful. So what's your point again?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Furthermore, didn't God create injustice?
He created justice. Injustice is the the lack thereof.
God in fact lied to them as he did not kill them, but by telling them, you should not eat from this tree because it is wrong, it that not in just?
They died, didn't they? I haven't seen any Eves running around as of late.
How were Adam and Eve supposed to make a moral decision without knowing it was right or wrong?
It wasn't a moral decision. It was a commandment. Just like a 3-year-old may not know that hitting is bad/evil, he still gets in trouble for doing it after being told not to.
Furthermore, Adam and Eve were seen as a husband and wife, wouldn't it be fine if they had sex, its not like they were no married.
Luckily for humanity they did have sex...not sure what your point is.
Post by
Sagramor
I've said this a couple times now.
Qua
humans, that isn't enough to bring our being fully to God.
Why the Hell not, this is why I'm asking. God should be able to make it so even if we are broken or limited, we can bring our being fully to Him.
Again, you're point at faults in God that don't exist. We turned away from God. It's like loosing your virginity...nothing you can do will make you innocent again.
This is actually an awesome analogy. Still, it
is
God, couldn't he just give us some of out "virginity" back?
I've been to many, many masses up in the mountains and in nature and it's absolutely beautiful. So what's your point again?
My point is; why do parents force their children to wake up early on a bloody Sunday to go to Church, when it makes just as much sense for them to go do their praying things later, in a park, watching the ducks.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Why the Hell not, this is why I'm asking. God
should
be able to make it so even if we are broken or limited, we can bring our being fully to Him.
I really can't go any further until you realize that God
shouldn't
have to to do anything when it comes to man.
This is actually an awesome analogy. Still, it
is
God, couldn't he just give us some of out "virginity" back?
No, because that would undermine our free will.
My point is; why do parents force their children to wake up early on a bloody Sunday to go to Church, when it makes just as much sense for them to go do their praying things later, in a park, watching the ducks.
It makes no sense to try to make kids focus on God in a park. Sorry.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Sagramor
I really can't go any further until you realize that God shouldn't have to to do anything when it comes to man.
I'm not saying He should, I'm saying that, if that is what He actually wants, God has all the means to make it happen.
No, because that would undermine our free will.
Not really. Our free will was still fully expressed and used. He'd just take out the consequences.
It makes no sense to try to make kids focus on God in a park. Sorry.
If little kids, the most easily fabled beings on the planet, need to be cut out from every outside factor to want to focus on
freakin'
God
, than doesn't that show there's something wrong?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Adam lived to be 900 something, God said he would strike them down and he went against that and he didn't
Please reread Genesis 2.
God didn't smite them down like he said he would.
Again, I think you need to reread Genesis 2.
God sent Adam and Eve up to fail.
How?
He punished them for sinning, which is when people choose to sin even though they know its wrong.
He punished them for disobeying his direct commandment, not for actual act of eating the fruit per se.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
if that is what He actually wants, God has all the means to make it happen.
No he doesn't. He gave those up when he gave us free will.
He'd just take out the consequences.
Which is denying our free will.
If little kids, the most easily fabled beings on the planet, need to be cut out from every outside factor to want to focus on
freakin'
God
, than doesn't that show there's something wrong?
With us, yes. With our culture, yes. With our naivete, yes.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it. For in the day that thou eatest thereof, thou shalt surely die."
For the day that you eat it, you shall surely die IE if you eat this fruit, you will die that day.
You shall surely die =/= you will die that day.
You -- future -- for sure -- death. Where in those 4 concepts do you see 'today'?
You're blatantly misinterpreting scripture.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
'In the day' rarely means 'today' in Hebrew...note "day" was used ~7 times so far in Genesis and not once did it mean day in the sense of 24 hours.
Notice 'today' is the last meaning out of 7.
Yom
:
age, always, continually, daily, birth, each, today,
From an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literal (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figurative (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverb) -- age, + always, + chronicals, continually(-ance), daily, ((birth-), each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever(-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (... Live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year(-ly), + younger.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I am reading the Bible from what it says, not what you are inferring.
No you're reading a translation and interpreting from what the translator was inferring.
it depends on the Bible you use:
Which is why I'm using the Hebrew. If you really think your English version is better than the original Hebrew, there isn't much I can say.
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