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Questions for a Catholic
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I thought you were paying attention when I explained it the
first
time.
So having illegitimate children isn't a "wrong" moral?
Pope having =/= Church declaring.
I think you'll have some trouble finding any Church document saying ex-marital sex is okay.
Post by
TheMediator
The Pope is the word of God from what I understand. So what the Pope does is much more relevant than what the Church says.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
The Pope is the word of God from what I understand. So what the Pope does is much more relevant than what the Church says.
Jesus is the Word of God.
The Pope is Bishop of Rome, Vicar of Jesus Christ, Successor of the Prince of the Apostles, Supreme Pontiff of the Universal Church, Primate of Italy, Archbishop and Metropolitan of the Roman Province, Sovereign of the State of Vatican City, and Servant of the Servants of God.
Did you actually think we worshiped the Pope? Lol.
Post by
TheMediator
No. I mean word as in he's the mouth of God from what I understand. What he says is taken to be what God says. I guess in that sense he's like Jesus, which is God, so he does have some God-like properties, since the Jesus version of God is the speaker of God, and the Pope is the speaker of God. Man Christianity is such a mess.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
No. I mean word as in he's the mouth of God from what I understand. What he says is taken to be what God says. I guess in that sense he's like Jesus, which is God, so he does have some God-like properties, since the Jesus version of God is the speaker of God, and the Pope is the speaker of God. Man Christianity is such a mess.
I honestly don't understand you. You come up with your own definition of the Pope, and with that conclude that Christianity is a mess.
The Pope is the mouth of the
Church
.
No, he does not have "some God-like properties."
No, Jesus is not a version of God. He is God.
Post by
TheMediator
No, he does not have "some God-like properties."
So the Pope is just an ordinary human like everyone else. Good for you. That's one step closer to ending your fairy tale fascination with magic. Next step to your recovery is admitting you are not in fact immortal, and will not live an eternal life just because you believe you will.
Post by
165617
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
So the Pope is just an ordinary human like everyone else. Good for you. That's one step closer to ending your fairy tale fascination with magic.
Actually you're the only one who has been talking about some God-pope.
You're so lost in your ideas that you refuse to accept that you don't actually understand what the Church believes.
Yes, the Pope is a human. Have a said otherwise even once?
Post by
TheMediator
Yes, the Pope is a human. Have a said otherwise even once?
Yes.
Popes are infallible in maters of faith and morals.
Humans are not infallible in any matter. Therefore, if one is infallible in any matter, they are not human.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
why did you choose to be a Catholic?
This is a bit of a long story.
I should start with some family background. My maternal grandmother is a very religious Catholic, and that's how my mother grew up. However, my mom fell away a bit in high-school/college and ended up having me at 17. At this point she went back to being a Catholic and raised me Catholic also. She then met my dad (who wasn't Catholic) and convinced him to convert before they got married.
So I grew up a solid Catholic up to and including my tenure at a Catholic seminary for 4 years. I ended up leaving however and quickly fell away from the faith all together, becoming more or less a Nietzschean/agnostic sort of thing.
When I finally returned to Catholicism it was because of 1 single reason: it was the only way I could make sense of the hate and despair in the wold (especially what I was feeling at the time). It gave me a purpose and a means to achieve it.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Yes, the Pope is a human. Have a said otherwise even once?
Yes.
Popes are infallible in maters of faith and morals.
Humans are not infallible in any matter. Therefore, if one is infallible in any matter, they are not human.
Yet another fallacy: "It doesn't exist, therefore it can't exist." It would only hold true if fallibility was in the very definition of human, which it's not.
As I have said several times already, the Pope is just a normal person whom God has chosen to be his vicar. Because God is rather intelligent, he knew that having a vicar who could make fallible pronouncements on the very principles of his Church would be a problem. So, using his power as God, he protects the Pope from ever erring when it comes to pronouncements of faith and morals.
How does that stop the Pope from being a man? It's not through the Pope's own power that he is infallible.
Post by
TheMediator
A human is someone simply one who has free will correct? However, how can one have free will if one is unable to choose between right and wrong? If God makes someone infallible, he has stripped them of their free will, because they can no longer choose between right and wrong.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
A human is someone simply one who has free will correct? However, how can one have free will if one is unable to choose between right and wrong? If God makes someone infallible, he has stripped them of their free will, because they can no longer choose between right and wrong.
They can choose right and wrong all they want (eg have illegitimate children).
It's make an erring statement when speaking on behalf of the Church that they can't do.
"Dis-abilities" don't destroy free will. Do we have any less free of a will by not being able to fly? No.
Post by
TheMediator
So... then the whole "God can't stop evil because it interferes with free will" thing is bull#$%^, since he can stop evil all he wants, he just can't stop people from THINKING about evil. Sounds to me like God doesn't have a problem with evil then, so he's not perfectly good - either that, or that the Pope isn't infallible. Since you'll never admit that God isn't not perfectly good, I think you'd best just admit that the Pope is in fact not infallible.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
So... then the whole "God can't stop evil because it interferes with free will" thing is bull#$%^, since he can stop evil all he wants.
Whoever said he could stop all the evil he wants? All he's doing is preventing his representative from making an error in pronounced doctrine. No one, not even God, is stopping him from disobeying it himself.
You'd best not keep putting words into my mouth.
Post by
TheMediator
I'll put whatever I want in your mouth, hehe.
But seriously, I don't understand how you can't see the connection between "preventing someone from making an error" and "preventing someone from making an error", unless you mean that evil isn't an error from the path of righteousness. If God can stop one thing and he can do anything, I don't see why he couldn't simply stop evil, unless he doesn't care to.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
But seriously, I don't understand how you can't see the connection between "preventing someone from
'doctrinizing'
an error" and "preventing someone from making an error"
I think that's what you meant to say.
And all evils are errors, but not all errors are evils. If I say "All penguins are mammals" I just made an error, but not an evil. God preventing me from saying that affects my free will just as much as preventing me from flying does, ie none.
Post by
TheMediator
And all evils are errors, but not all errors are evils. If I say "All penguins are mammals" I just made an error, but not an evil. God preventing me from saying that affects my free will just as much as preventing me from flying does, ie none.
Touche.
Post by
343569
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
If you don't believe it's real, why would it matter to you whether you were baptized or not?
If it does turn out to be real, you gained a close fellowship with God.
If it turns out to be fake, you got a little wet.
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