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Various Pros and Cons of the Races
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Post by
Monday
I've stopped bothering replying to Rankkorr. Nothing is going to get through his fanboy head.
I find this ironic...
I see him basing his arguments on evidence, fact and quotes. Yours are based on "Nuh uh! Nuh uh!"
Get some evidence and stop insulting people and calling anyone who disagrees a fanboy and maybe we'll listen to you.
I base my arguments on evidence as well, but he ignores the portions of evidence that disagree with his viewpoint and says "No, THIS is how it happened!"
In Theramore, if Varian truly was balls to the walls racist against all Orcs, he wouldnt've agreed to go to the summit in the first place. Not to mention he found himself actually LIKING Thrall, until he had the emotional bomb thrown at him in the form of Garona. Thrall never had the emotional bomb thrown at him, but if it wasn't Garona who showed up and instead, say, Blackmoore, I would expect the same reaction from Thrall.
Of course, no major Horde characters have had emotional bombs thrown at them at important times, so I wouldn't expect Rankkorr to understand.
Not to mention, you've ignored Rankkorr's statement of "lol, I'd like to see Varian TRY! Thrall would wipe the floor with him because he's so powerful!" How is that not the mark of a fanboy?
Fact is, you can't say "Varian was oh so wrong in the peace summit!" because nobody else was in the same position that Varian was in. Again, if it was Blackmoore who showed up instead of Garona, I would expect the same situation to have happened except with Thrall and Varian's positions reversed.
Rankkorr isn't even trying to look at the lore objectively, like he claims he's doing. (and again, a biased person saying "I have no bias" is one of the most dishonest things that someone can do) He's just looking for reasons to hate Varian so that he can pad his already disturbing love for Thrall.
See? There we go, facts and quotes right there =D
Although tbh the way Rank put that Thrall would kill Varian wasn't the best way to say it, but it is true. While Varian is a peerless warrior Thrall is just simply more powerful.
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Monday
Although tbh the way Rank put that Thrall would kill Varian wasn't the best way to say it, but it is true. While Varian is a peerless warrior Thrall is just simply more powerful.
See, I disagree. First of all, Thrall's abilities aren't his own. He can ask the elements to grant him their favor, but they would'nt grant him things like tidal waves and earthquakes to kill one man.
Second, Warriors have succeeded where Thrall has failed. Mannoroth, anyone?
This is true, however if Thrall was under attack from Varian, unless Thrall taunted him or something, the Elements would come to his aid.
Post by
Rankkor
yup, Thrall was trained as a warrior even earlier than varian (thrall began his training at the age of 6, at that time varian was just a kid living on stormwind he began training on his "teen" years)
so, thrall has more training=Check.
Varian while well trained has only been active on the field of battle for less than 3 years, has never fought a major battle other than 1 (warsong gulch, wich was a minor skirmish) while Thrall has been fighting ever since the day he was born, from the rescue of the orcs, the exodus of the horde, the fight at hyjal and more.
so Thrall having more actual years of experience in the field of battle= Check.
Thrall is THE most powerfull shaman in the world, aided by the elements, capable of sundering castles to bits of dust and 1shotting necropolis from the skies, summoning all the force of nature at his calling, while varian is just a simple warrior, who when disarmed is uncapable of doing anything other than punching someone.
Thrall having more power= Check.
Varian is armed with a couple of swords of elven craftmanship, while Thrall is armed with the legendary DoomHammer, the most powerfull Warhammer in the world.
Thrall having better weapons=not check (varian's own weapons are almost as ancient as thrall's)
thus there you have it, as much as you love varian, if he fights thrall he's gonna get his rear served.
Varian NEVER WANTED to go to the summit, he went ONLY BECAUSE HIS SON asked him to go, the comics say so :P
and since you love to use the "emotional bomb" card so much let's get on that ground.
Thrall went to durnholde to rescue his fellow orcs from the prison, he tries to parlay peace with blackmoore, he responds by trowing the severed head of the person thrall loved more in his entire life.
did thrall became so enraged that he executed every single last one of the humans of durnholde? nope, he was FURIOUS, and he ordered the atack since it was clear blackmoore would have no peace, but once blackmoore was dead, he regained his cool, and showed mercy to the humans, both to the women and children as well as to the soldiers who lay down their weapons.
Varian just saw garona and imidietly was all like "THRALL IS A BACKSTABBING BASTARD, AND I WILL KILL YOU ALL"! venting his rage at the wrong person.
as much as garona hurted him THRALL IS NOT GARONA, him blaming thrall for garona's actions are the result of a man who can't think clearly.
Thrall was able to think clear in Durnholde when he didn't held the other humans responsible for tari's death, Varian was incapable of doign the same in theramoore.
before you call biased someone just admit that your god varian isn't as perfect as you picture him to be.
Thrall can beat him to a pulp, and he is biased to an extreme with the orcs.
Post by
Joemaster240
blackmoore is dead i because thrall killed him. And even if he showed up i doubt with thralls personality he would react badly. Thrall just doesn't seem like the person to fly off the handle unless something extremly major occurs like the wrathgate incident.
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
Except, Thrall would never call on the Elements to aid him in a one on one fight.... not to mention, the Elements themselves probably wouldn't assist if they were called on; destroying the Necropolis was about destroying something that would poison the land if it landed, and Thrall asked the Earth not to injure anyone when the walls and Durnholde fell.
I have to disagree with you on the training though Rank; yes Thrall did start at 6, but seeing as Arthas started with his own weapon masters at 7, there is a chance Varian did as well, practicing against his father, Lothar and the Stormwind trainers as well(just saying). Varian did help with the mop up after the Second War, so he does have more then 'just 3 years' of battle experience, and he was fighting against some of the threats against Stormwind before and after his fall into depression. So yeah, Thrall seems to have done more, but we don't have all of Varian's young adult hood and early years of leading Stormwind all written down.
Post by
Joemaster240
i see it as this, neither thrall nor varian are stronger. Both are strong in there own ways.
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
humm I seem to recall vagely that varian fled to stormwind at the age of 7. so he didn't started at that age.....
and again, key words "mop up" not quite the same as a large scale battle.
Thrall woudn't call something massive as an earthquake to fight 1 man, but earthquakes aren't the only thing shamans can call in battle.
in the large scale of things Thrall has done more battle in his life, and his training is more extensive than varian's own training.
don't forget that while Arthas and Varian during training had just that "training" and harmless sparring, Thrall had real matches with real weapons on real combat against several oponents in the arena as a gladiator at a young age, for several years.
maybe Thrall wound't "wipe out the floor with varian" (aka 1shot him without the slightest effort) but he would win, because while on a duel he doesn't use the elements, on an actual battle he does (him using thunder against mannoroth or varimathras?)
I'm well aware that Thrall is not invincible (mannoroth swiped him off in 1 hit) but he's definitly MUCH more stronger and experienced than varian.
main reason Grom was able to kill mannoroth was also due to his experience him being a warrior with over 5 decades of experience in combat.
and thrall DOES have more experience than varian.
Post by
Rankkor
fojar, you do realise that somoeone who repeats the word "Fanboy" more than 5 times in a row in less than 30 min is one too?
stop atacking me. do you see ME ataking you for your ideas? what the hell is your problem with me?
so I have a diferent view of the game than you have, what gives you the right to judge me for it? what gives you the right to offend me, and berate me like that?
have I been hostile to you? I debate what you post but I'm at least mature enough to never touch you in my debates, why can't you grow up?
jesus christ-........
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Joemaster240
One thing your failing to see rankkorr is varians own time in the orcish arena's. He was himself until recently a gladiatorial slave himself for awhile and was forced to fight.
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
humm I seem to recall vagely that varian fled to stormwind at the age of 7. so he didn't started at that age.....Check again Rank, Varian was 12/13 when he went to Lordaeron; he is a year older then Arthas.
and again, key words "mop up" not quite the same as a large scale battle.No, but it wasn't a walk in the park either; there were still demon addicted orcs out there, not all had fallen into the funks yet.
don't forget that while Arthas and Varian during training had just that "training" and harmless sparring, Thrall had real matches with real weapons on real combat against several oponents in the arena as a gladiator at a young age, for several years.Only thing that means is that Thrall had more death in his face; the weapon masters, especially Muradin didn't hold back there blows during training, as they were setting up both children to become kings eventually and fight on the battlefields.
maybe Thrall wound't "wipe out the floor with varian" (aka 1shot him without the slightest effort) but he would win, because while on a duel he doesn't use the elements, on an actual battle he does (him using thunder against mannoroth or varimathras?)Thrall has honour though, and if he is as experienced and powerful as you say, why would he need to call on the Elements?(again, that's if they would help; Mannoroth and Vari were demons, and not of Azeroth....)
I'm well aware that Thrall is not invincible (mannoroth swiped him off in 1 hit) but he's definitly MUCH more stronger and experienced than varian.Stronger doesn't mean much; Doomhammer kicked the crap out of Thrall, and that ogre nearly turned him into a pile of mush. Strength is only a part of the battle; Varian has some speed on him(seen in the fights in the gladiator pits, the Warsong battle, and Onyxia), so just saying 'he'll win because of this' is a little narrow focused.
and thrall DOES have more experience than varian./shrug, Agree to disagree; again, we know the full training experience of Thrall, we don't know Varian's.
Post by
Rankkor
You feign objectivity and I hate that.
even if you hate it KEEP IT TO YOURSELF.
I dislike many things about you, but for the sake of being civil I don't yell them out to the 4 winds, this is a place of civil discussion, if you dislike something about me, just shut it, I don't wanna know it, the rest of the forum doesn't wanna know it.
take my example and learn from it, even when I disagree strongly with what you believe I have never said something agressive to you, why not? because that upsets the other users who don't wanna see this forum become a flame-war.
so for the sake of civilty, SHUT IT whenever you feel like telling me how biased I am, or god forbid what else,because that is a violation of the forum rules wich specifically say that atacking other users is forbidden.
how many threads you want locked before you get that point? this is NOT a place for you to tell me how to behave or how to think or what to believe, we all have our freedom to think what we want, if you disagree with my opinions or those of another user, then debate ,but DO NOT atack those who think diferent from you.
that whole "I call it for what I see it" is just B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T and you know it, for the love of god KEEP IT CIVIL MAN.
I don't atack you, could you please stop doing the same to me?
my god........
funden and adams are alliance fans, adamsm in specific is also a HUGE varian fan, and while we disagree in a lot of stuff, we NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER insult each other.
even when I disagree with their opinions they have a right to have a diferent opinion than mine, and I'm nobody to make fun of them for believing what they believe.
likewise they do for me, they never atack me or berate me for what I believe because I have a right to believe whatever the hell I want.
seriously man grow up....
Post by
Monday
Only thing that means is that Thrall had more death in his face; the weapon masters, especially Muradin didn't hold back there blows during training, as they were setting up both children to become kings eventually and fight on the battlefields.
And before somebody says: "But that is just training by some dwarf," remember that Arthas used moves taught by Muradin to save himself in the battle against Kael'thas, to stop Kael from killing him with Felo'melorn?
Thus we see that sparring and teachers is as helpful as gladiator pits (oh and Varian fought as a gladiator, same as Thrall. Thus they had the same training.)
so for the sake of civilty, SHUT IT whenever you feel like telling me how biased I am, or god forbid what else,because that is a violation of the forum rules wich specifically say that atacking other users is forbidden.
how many threads you want locked before you get that point? this is NOT a place for you to tell me how to behave or how to think or what to believe, we all have our freedom to think what we want, if you disagree with my opinions or those of another user, then debate ,but DO NOT atack those who think diferent from you.
that whole "I call it for what I see it" is just B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T and you know it, for the love of god KEEP IT CIVIL MAN.
Wanna tell that to Tauren for me Rank =D (This is in the spirit of fun, I'm not insulting either of you. Well, I hope I'm not).
Post by
358417
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
I did not made a post saying why "i'm better than you" I made a post to say taht while I debate your ideas, I don't call you names, I don't make fun of what you believe, I don't insult you.
and yhea I said shut it because nobody here want's to hear it, nobody likes it when a civil discussion becomes a flamewar and that's what you made of this.
I came and posted my opinion about what is being discussed, and rather than do what funden and adamsm did (they did posted against my opinion but without atacking me) you imidietly went to say "you are just a fanboy"
I don't know in how many languages must I say it before is clear, so I'll just let the mods handle this, I'm tired of your attitude, is like I can't post anything that is contrary to the alliance or varian because there you will be to insult me
and I won't take your crap and your attitude, specially when i've given no reasons for it.
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