This site makes extensive use of JavaScript.
Please enable JavaScript in your browser.
Live
PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
Beta
Paladins DEMAND Buffs!
Post Reply
Return to board index
Post by
pezz
So raid bosses come back to life after a week,, lore-wise? No. There are no Forsaken holy priests, just as there are no shadow priest draenei, as that would corrupt them,
thus mutating them into Eredar demons.
I realize that saying 'that sounds really cool' in reference to this kind of obliterates the view point most Draenei are supposed to have lore-wise, but I would roll a priest if I could be Eredar. And I HATE priests.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Varaconn
So raid bosses come back to life after a week,, lore-wise? No. There are no Forsaken holy priests, just as there are no shadow priest draenei, as that would corrupt them, thus mutating them into Eredar demons.
Replayability != class/race justification, El Capitan Strawman. Note the fuss they made over justifying the reemergence of nelf mages and troll druids. Class/race justifications matter for lore purposes.
The thing is, those Class/race combos are in the game, the lore, and have been for a very long time. Nelf mages have always been present in the game. Troll druids can be easily justified through the existence of ZG and ZA. They just haven't been playable until now.
In contrast, Undead are explicitly stated in lore to be unable to wield the light. There's a big difference.
You can somewhat compare raid resets to lore-contradicting specs, like Holy Priests for undead. Undead priests are justified, as Shadow priests and sometimes Discipline priests. However for game balance, they are able to be holy. It's not exactly the same as bosses coming back, but in the same vein.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pezz
Well, they're getting their healin' power from somewhere. Riddle me that, Batman.
It's not the holy light, if that's what you were thinking.
Not sure if the joke is going to make sense and/or be funny. We'll see.
Post by
669729
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Varaconn
Well, they're getting their healin' power from somewhere. Riddle me that, Batman.
Lore-wise, they don't get healing power at all. It was mentioned early that undead "Healers" are basically surgeons. They get stitched back together with more parts, or the like.
The difference between priests and paladins is that Undeads are Shadow Priests. The holy portion is simply a game mechanic. In lore, they would be unable to use it,
regardless of source.
Paladins, on the other hand, would have no such forced game mechanic. Even if they siphoned it the way Blood Knights used to, they still
wouldn't be able to use it.
There's no room for justification.
In other news, in Lore, Blood Elf paladins are now true paladins, and no longer siphon energy from a Naaru.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Varaconn
No, I just didn't take your wording as being past-tense. My mistake.
The game is the lore, yes, but there are differences. Technically, Blizzard said that Sunwalkers aren't literally paladins, it's just that the class is the closest thing. Troll priests probably technically aren't
any
of the specs (except certain characters), yet they are classified as priests in-game. There are many classes, side classes, sub classes that have been lumped in with in-game classes for mechanics.
I agree that a fallen paladin, who was raised as undead could theoretically (though based on the personality of most of the undead in the game, this would be a very rare occurrence) re-align themselves with their previous faiths and beliefs. However, this doesn't change the fact that, again, lore-wise, they would be unable to wield that recovered power.
They could maybe,
maybe
justify it by making Undead Paladins (then, by extension, Holy priests) take damage every time they cast a spell, but that would cause an imbalance between them and other Paladins, and within themselves of course. I get hurt for attacking...shouldn't I maybe hit harder as a result? Oh, now you're more powerful than all other paladins. What about them? It's just a huge can of worms not worth opening.
Post by
44284
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Varaconn
That had occurred to me as well. Quite frankly, though, I would simply attribute that to a mechanics thing.
I know, I know, I keep saying mechanics, mechanics, but use some of the druid spells as a comparison. Moonfire and Starfall are considered Arcane spells. I thought Night Elf druids had forsaken the arcane, yet this whole time, those hypocrites have been using it? If you ask me, they should have their own magic school. I would argue that the case with "Avenger's Shield" and "Unholy Light" should theoretically have their own school...like Dark, or Unholy. Or, even still, they could at least be in the Shadow school. I think that was just Blizzard being lazy.
Post by
Monday
Hell, if flippin' belfs could "syphon off" power from a captured Naaru to empower all their paladins
Play W3. You notice that all the priests are... ELVES. Whoa! Now you may ask what this has to do with my earlier statement priest =/= paladin
It's simple. Paladins were former Priests of the
Holy Light
who were trained in weaponry. Forsaken priests do not use any form of light. Thus, no paladins.
Well, they're getting their healin' power from somewhere. Riddle me that, Batman.
Research is good for you
the Shadow
Also, here's another of my earlier statements backed up by Blizzard ;Q: Can you please explain how "light" works? The lore states that undead are physically incapable of using the light, much like the Broken, but then we have Forsaken players casting healing spells, and Sir Zeliek in Naxxramas using pseudo-paladin abilities. A: Without spoiling too much,
we can tell you that wielding the Light is a matter of having willpower or faith in one's own ability to do it.
That's why there are evil paladins (for example, the Scarlet Crusade and Arthas before he took up Frostmourne).
For the undead (and Forsaken), this requires such a great deal of willpower that it is
exceedingly rare, especially since it is self-destructive
.
When undead channel the Light, it feels (to them) as if their entire bodies are being consumed in righteous fire. Forsaken healed by the Light (whether the healer is Forsaken or not) are effectively cauterized by the effect: sure, the wound is healed, but the healing effect is cripplingly painful. Thus, Forsaken priests are beings of unwavering willpower; Forsaken (and death knight) tanks suffer nobly when they have priest and paladin healers in the group; and Sir Zeliek REALLY hates himself.
Now, I have bolded a couple interesting statements.
Sure, there are Holy Priests, however they are so rare there are a only a couple in existence (the card game priest and sir Zeliek), but they
feel as if they are on fire
when any spell is cast. And it is self destructive. I don't see Forsaken Paladins in the future, as they would be in intense pain and destroy themselves whenever they cast spells.
Edit: Varaconn: I would imagine that they cast it simply because they have no mind to feel pain. And Unholy Light really should be classified as a Shadow spell. And they were all former Paladins before they were rezzed. There are no former Forsaken paladins however, as they were immune to the plague. If they were killed, they became Death Knights, not normal scourge, and certainly not Forsaken.
Post Reply
You are not logged in. Please
log in
to post a reply or
register
if you don't already have an account.