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3 Roles or 4?
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Post by
Amitar
I'm kind of curious as to peoples opinions regarding whether there are currently 3 roles in terms of raids and dungeons or as of cataclysm, 4. Or for that matter if there should be.
Everyone knows the 3 basic roles for any MMO:
Tanking
Healing
Damage Dealing
The question is: Is there now a 4th valid role?
Support.
Retadin's now have the functionality to act as "off healers."
Demonolgy locks are more functional for buffing groups than as outright DPS.
Arcane mages have functionality coming out the eyeballs that's almost necessary these days.
Hunters are now primary kiters again.
Etc.
I suppose the question is, do these jobs make up there of role, or should they been seen as a subset of a DPS's functionality?
What importance is and should be placed on supprting groups in our new slice of Azeroth?
Cheers.
- Amitar
Post by
Interest
To be honest most if not all DPS have some form of support.
Post by
Adamsm
All classes have some type of support buff to assist already.
Post by
115812
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Post by
Adamsm
When I hear "Support" I think of a character who doesn't attack or heal directly but instead uses buffs / debuffs to help their party member down mobs.So, they would have to level as a group, as most of the support classes from other games sucked when it came down to actually killing things? Looking at you Priests from Fire Emblem.
Post by
RPGplayer713
Dislike my bringing it up, but there are a couple of classes in LOTRO that have builds that are set up almost entirely around support; buffing, debuffing, or heavy CC.
Then again, LOTRO also had 6 spots in a group.
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115812
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23608
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670547
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Post by
Amitar
It's an interesting concept and it might work if there were specific support specs. I would also say that it would probably only be in a raid situation; it is unlikely that you'd want to take up one of your 5 spots with somebody that doesn't really heal, do damage, or take damage. There has already been at least 1 fight in WoW with a support role built in, the motorcycle in the Flame Lav fight, and it was a really fun gimmick, but I don't think many people would want to do it every fight. I've played mmo's with support classes, Lineage II and LotR to name a couple; they ranged from really crappy to stupidly op, but they all had one thing in common...trying to solo level them was a nightmare.
Well I'm not suggesting there are support
classes
, just specs really, and even those depend on how you build them.
Going back to my Retadin example you can build them as pure DPS:
http://www.wowhead.com/talent#sbhMZMZcbGsdksdfz
(pew pew)
Or more Support focused:
http://www.wowhead.com/talent#sbhbZobZcrhsdkodfd
(mostly Word of Glory based, could easily be stun/bubble based)
Warning I'm just throwing up specs here as examples, they're not really optimized by any theorycrafting I know of.
So could the support Ret be a viable alternative to a pure DPS in, say 25 man raids?
Also with dual speccing, WoWs system is the more pleasant than most at leveling for player who want to try support specs compared to LotRO at least, can't speak for Lineage, never played it.
Designing specs around 'supporting roles' existed in vanilla, and to some extent in burning crusade, but not anymore, and I doubt Blizzard would bring it back.
Heh, you've actually stumbled onto my reason for asking here. Ever since Vanilla I've had a lock as my main (was Alliance back then, rerolled Horde in TBC to join my mates guild) and part of the reason for that was the support functionality (it's a debuffing class, it says so in manual, dammit!) With dual speccing I see no reason that pure DPS classes can't have greater functionality.
I live in hope I guess.
Post by
Pwntiff
The WoW raiding model isn't designed around a support role, though.
Yes, you can have multiple players tweak their specs for the most synergy, but WoW raiding is designed to need:
Enough tanks to grab everything in the fight without dying
Enough healers to keep the raid alive through the fight
Enough DPS to kill the fight before enrage timer or healer's OoM
My least favorite fight out of all of Wrath was Razuvious-25 because you
needed
at least two Priests with hit gear. When you start adding a fourth role, you start back down the slippery slope of needing x class with y talents.
Post by
GVHB
So could the support Ret be a viable alternative to a pure DPS in, say 25 man raids?
It wouldn't, your sacrificing DPS by dumping your talent points in talents that are bad for a DPS spec.
Post by
Noxychu
This thread makes me miss the class diversity in Ragnarok Online.
There are classes that only cast ground effects to help raise certain stats, or element damage, etc. (Bards, Dancers, Sages.)
Or specific target buffs/support, like a Scholars soul-exhale (Giving you all of their mana-bar, very useful, I wish Wow had Scholars.)
Then of course there are the Smiths and Chemists, that have pure crafting class-specs and can not level by their own means and have to rely on a party exp leech.
All in all, for Wow to have a purely 'support' class, would mean a new class entirely. Not modification of those currently ingame. It just wouldnt work.
I'd totally play a fully dedicated support role, though. I miss it.
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606231
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367590
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166878
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Post by
DarkOpeth
This thread makes me miss the class diversity in Ragnarok Online.
There are classes that only cast ground effects to help raise certain stats, or element damage, etc. (Bards, Dancers, Sages.)
Or specific target buffs/support, like a Scholars soul-exhale (Giving you all of their mana-bar, very useful, I wish Wow had Scholars.)
Then of course there are the Smiths and Chemists, that have pure crafting class-specs and can not level by their own means and have to rely on a party exp leech.
All in all, for Wow to have a purely 'support' class, would mean a new class entirely. Not modification of those currently ingame. It just wouldnt work.
I'd totally play a fully dedicated support role, though. I miss it.
Interesting point, although I agree with what has been said already. Through buffs and certain mechanics every class provides some sort of support already. Also Noxy, you should change your description from <Grand Master Artist> to <Illustrious Grand Master artist> (if you think you're that good) ;)
Post by
211100
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Post by
Noxychu
Interesting point, although I agree with what has been said already. Through buffs and certain mechanics every class provides some sort of support already. Also Noxy, you should change your description from <Grand Master Artist> to <Illustrious Grand Master artist> (if you think you're that good) ;)
Contrary to popular belief, we dont actually get to pick our own titles. The admins pick them, and put them in, without our prior knowledge. Its a fun little quirk, and I was very flattered when they picked Master-Artist for mine.
Post by
134377
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