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Live
PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
Beta
Feral Bear Expertise
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Post by
90123
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Post by
129046
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Post by
pelf
I think that as we move up in the iLvls, we will naturally gain more avoidance from primary stats and naturally gain more Expertise Rating and Hit Rating as secondary stats. As we need less to reforge to Dodge, we will keep more of those stats that naturally occur on gear.
Also, right now, even with low hit/exp, our threat is WAY higher than DPS can keep up with.
Post by
Falkor
it is mainly a threat stat, but could also be considered a survival stat due to more hit/exp means more hits, which leads to more crits, which means more savage defense....but really it isnt that necessary.
on another note though....should we be worried about a threat nerf in the near future or is blizzard cool with this? i remember throughout the beta and everything they had nerfed tank threat, saying they actually wanted tanks to work for it. but then by the end of the beta they buffed tank threat higher than it was in LK even, AND gave us vengeance...so we have to work for about the first hit or two then we just take off threat-wise. anyone know if they are happy or unhappy with how threat/tanking is working atm?
Post by
pelf
I don't think so. I think it's meant to be this high and the DPS are meant to creep up. I imagine the curve of tank threat going up at a shallower grade (due to higher Vengeance) than the curve of DPS threat going up due to higher damage. At some point, they would intersect. If Blizzard worked the math right, they will intersect past the level of Vengeance and the level of DPS damage for this expansion.
Post by
113039
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Post by
Thror
Personally, i find Expertise and Hit quite low on my priority list currently. It's because of a few factors:
I do not need it for threat. My TPS is far too good with very low amounts of Expretise and Hit.
I do not need Hit to land a Taunt. Taunt being able to miss was actually my main reason for stacking Hit in WotLK.
It is correct that Dodged/Parried/Missed attacks do not proc Savage Defense, but despite having low amounts of hit stats, i am not behind my buddy Paladin tank when it comes to reducing damage. I have been checking out lots of logs, and the only real differences in Damage Taken depend on whether we did or didn't manage to avoid an avoidable boss ability. Melee damage taken on fights with similar length is very similar, and only swings up or down in noones favor depending on RNG luck with avoidance.
I do need Hit to land an Interrupt, however, for crucial boss abilities, we never assign only one interrupter. My raid compositions always have a minimum of 4 people with interrupt off the GCD and with a 10 sec CD, which was sufficient for all the bosses i have fought so far. Also i have never actually had the misfortune of my Skull Bash missing, and i did do a fair amount of interrupting. Yesterday for example, on Maloriak.
Since we are at the entry level of raiding with people stepping into raids with blues, and because of the new healing model, it is far too important to stack stats that
reduce damage
. Mitigation, avoidance, those are the key stats.
Therefore, i neglect Expertise and Hit, so to say. The stats i value the most currently are Stamina = Agility > Dodge > Mastery > Crit. In that order. I do not value Stamina over Agility, hence why you can see me using Stam/Agi gems instead of raw Stam. My health pool might be lower for Heroic modes of raids, but we do not do those yet obviously, and for the normals, my health pool of 171k is very sufficient. My dodge chance of 40% with a trinket proc and 34% without helps quite a lot as well.
I have also noticed a fun little thing with a Warrior tank as a buddy. When farming trash in Bastion of Twilight for BoE epix, MOSTLY... i tank all the trash. The warrior pretty much can not pull anything off me unless he uses taunt. And... i am able to survive it all. A few times when i died because of failed interrupts or CC, the warrior tried to pick the stuff for me. As soon as he was targetted by all the enemies, he got gibbed instantly. This was an even bigger issue on the casters, who just did not kill me, and who literally obliterated him. Might be a skill issue though, i am not sure if he used the full potential of Shockwave and Demoralizing Shout for example.
Post by
pelf
Shockwave is amazing. I see warriors using far too little of it.
Post by
Raleandris
Shockwave is amazing. I see warriors using far too little of it.
Too much of this.
Post by
pelf
I don't get it... is that a double negative or...
Post by
Raleandris
I don't get it... is that a double negative or...
That was an agreement of too many warriors not using enough shockwave.
Post by
pelf
Ohh, danke.
Post by
18167
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Post by
yodadoe
I have to agree that I've found little need to worry about expertise (or hit) right now. The ONLY time I lose aggro now is when I'm pulling numerous mobs and the stupid DPS start attacking before I've had a chance to hit more than once. If I my first hit doesn't land and the dps are already hitting on them, yes, I do lose aggro. But unless I get stunned or distracted, it's not hard to get it back. I never lose aggro on single targets. As others have said, we'll probably only need to worry about expertise two major content patches from now, when DPS is stupidly high.
Post by
LookOut
Exp had a small survivability gain in addition to threat.
When a boss parries you, the next attack is 40% faster.
That's one of the reasons no DPS should attack from the front, with low Exp they could parry gib you.
I don't know what the situation is like in Cata for parryhaste on bosses, but in ICC, only Sindy and Bloodqueen had parryhaste enabled. So I'm not sure it's THAT required ...
Post by
109094
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Post by
18167
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pelf
Afaik parry haste has been removed
Significantly reduced. Very few bosses do it.
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