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Ease of Play vs. Effectivenss...Pally vs. Death Knight
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Post by
483378
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Monday
I'm fairly sure a Frost DK is more viable for PvP than a Ret paladin. If you want to do PvE as well, or perhaps do PvP as a side project, ret is the way to go.
Again, just opinion.
Post by
svl007
as soon as you play against any decent team you won't get a kill as ret/healer in 2's
against a dps/healer the rets dmg cooldowns are to easily dispelled/nullified in other ways
against a double dps he can't peel enough to keep you alive
honestly stick with dk/healer and let him spam necrotic strike while tunneling healer, if you can squeeze in some shocks on heals you'll win against healer/dps eventually and against 2 dps a dk can peel much easier for you
As for your dillema, play 2's with your friend if you don't want to abandon him, find a good 3's for your pvp needs.
Post by
Orranis
I'm fairly sure a Frost DK is more viable for PvP than a Ret paladin. If you want to do PvE as well, or perhaps do PvP as a side project, ret is the way to go.
Again, just opinion.
Maybe before 4.2, but now I'm not so sure. Paladin's damage is ridiculous with cooldowns, but could use a buff without. It suffers from purges and dispells heavily when it comes to things like Hand of Freedom (though to be fair its major use is getting out of whatever you were just put in, as that puts it in DR unlike using it preemptively) and Avenging Wrath. However, they have two very useful and reliableCCs that do not share DR. That is extremely useful. Frost has one incredibly unreliable, though also incredibly powerful, CC that requires a short ranged, can be avoided, and is potentially very dangerous for the caster if it gets interrupted. Furthermore, Retribution has far more base survivability, which Frost lacks, and fair survival cooldows as well.
Edit: Again, depends on the comp. Dk/healer may be better than Ret/healer, but Ret/Caster or Ret/Melee is probably better than either one paired up with a Frost DK.
Post by
255458
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
484925
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Orranis
Respec DK to unholy for 70k burst, respec your self to enh. You don't want to go healer/dps in2 s becasue matches will be 25 min+.
Unholy/enh is pretty beast burst damage, just focus their squishiest target and keep your self up with self heals. Ghoul/gargoyle/wolves=GG healer good luck getting a spell cast off
Excuse me, where does Unholy get any burst? At all? And self heals, lol? Death Strike? It's like, a whole tick of Recuperate! Unholy in 2's is pretty much unusable unless you're running with a healer. At the moment, Frost DK is easier to play and is better than a Ret Pally in 2s. Or any bracket for that matter.
Really? I don't play a Ret Paladin, but from your Profile it appears you don't play either. It could be true, but I don't think just because you say so.
Post by
484925
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Azazel
Right now, there is absolutely no reason bring a Ret Pally over a Frost DK. That's just how bad Ret sucks right now. (Not saying Frost is bad)
Post by
Lorkin
While Ret paladin is somewhat easy to play, I believe a DK is even easier. Ret paladin has tremendous burst and a decent amount of both cc and anti-cc. You have to know how to use it though, at which correct time. If your friend doesn't even have the most basic of DK abilities on his hot bar, you have a bigger issue than just class ease of play.
I'd take the advice of fellow players here and go double dps. Because you went on that winning streak with your rogue buddy doesn't mean you can't do the same with the DK. Have him duel you or practice some of his class abilities before you go back into the ring.
In terms of ret burst dps being dispelled, yes this happens but rarely at the lower arena brackets. You'd be surprised how long I keep my wings up during a match when the lower level bracket teams aren't paying attention. That or they don't know its dispellable.
Either case, no offense, but your friend sounds like a noob. Are you sure you want to wait till he levels a paladin to try arenas with him? DK's are a very strong class at the moment for PvP and Arenas. Work on getting his skills up, understanding his class, and it'll be much easier to nabs some wins with him. Good Luck.
Post by
Orranis
While Ret paladin is somewhat easy to play, I believe a DK is even easier. Ret paladin has tremendous burst and a decent amount of both cc and anti-cc. You have to know how to use it though, at which correct time. If your friend doesn't even have the most basic of DK abilities on his hot bar, you have a bigger issue than just class ease of play.
Well sure, but now DK's have to do much more drastic things to survive, and all of our CC has to be set up very well in order to work. Sure you have to know what to Freedom off, but you also have to know what to IBF off or what you can dodge with a well timed AMS besides just damage.
Don't run a healer in2s unless you want to experince 35+ min games, Unholy+Enh shuts down any healer in matter of seconds: 6 sec CD interupt+5s silence+Necrotic strike taking care of most instant cast heals, the healer won't ever get a cast off.
Frost is
much
better suited for this task. With Pillar of Frost up it's Necrotics hit much harder and abosrb slightly more than an Unholy's, and Unholy has zero burst DPS, while Frost has it in truckloads. Furthermore, with the perma Death-Runes, Frost is guaranteed four Necrotics while Unholy can only be guaranteed two. You could argue Gnawing the healer as well as Unholy, if the ghoul ever had enough energy to actually cast Gnaw when you want it.
Right now, there is absolutely no reason bring a Ret Pally over a Frost DK. That's just how bad Ret sucks right now. (Not saying Frost is bad)
Two reliable CC's that do not share DR? Better mobility that can also be used on partner? Better defensive abilities (like if you're running double DPS)?
Post by
Azazel
It's what I read on arenajunkies anyway.
Post by
Orranis
From 4.1 maybe.
Post by
Azazel
I don't know. It's a long time since I read it.
Post by
Poptart
Respec DK to unholy for 70k burst, respec your self to enh. You don't want to go healer/dps in2 s becasue matches will be 25 min+.
Unholy/enh is pretty beast burst damage, just focus their squishiest target and keep your self up with self heals. Ghoul/gargoyle/wolves=GG healer good luck getting a spell cast off
Excuse me, where does Unholy get any burst? At all? And self heals, lol? Death Strike? It's like, a whole tick of Recuperate! Unholy in 2's is pretty much unusable unless you're running with a healer.
Recuperate
Death Strike
Not to mention Lichborne -> Deathcoil spam.
On topic: DK's, in particular Frost, is very solid in a lot more comps right now.
Post by
818599
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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