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Why so much hate on MoP?
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Post by
Atik
I think as players we can see that Blizzard is trying to cater to the kids. "Mommy I want a Panda character. "
Maybe there will be more sales? If Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles wasn't taken I bet we might see a turtle race next? Martial arts seems to be selling....
Try reading some of the original TMNT comics. They weren't really intended for kids. Young adults, maybe, but not children.Heck, just look at TMNT 2K(the most recent revival); people died, were horribly disfigured, had massively vicious things happen to them...heck, I'll
let TVTropes
do the explaining.
But those vicious things still happened and were presented in a child-ish manner.
It is like how you said "people die horribly in Kingdom Hearts"
Doesn't stop it from being child-like.
Post by
xaratherus
Considering how many people make that mistake, the argument is clearly not invalid.
The popularity of an invalid argument - the popularity of anything - does not make it right. It just makes it popular. A million people can hold an opinion that's absolutely incorrect, yet that doesn't make the opinion incorrect, it just means it's an opinion with a popular following.
They argue that the inclusion of anthropomorphic pandas are too childish for the game. As I'll point out below, anthropomorphic cows in the United States popular culture are just as childish. Thus why I said that the argument is invalid, because from the standpoint of an outsider, with nothing vested in the discussion, they would consider both to be
just
as childish.
Talking cows, by the way, is a pretty poor example of kid friendliness. Minotauros ate people in his labyrinth, after all.
And the Cowboys of Moo Mesa and Back at the Barnyard are both kid-friendly cartoons that feature talking cows that are far more cosmetically reminiscent of Tauren than the Greek minotaur. On the other hand I'd be glad to provide you a list of a number of Chinese myths that paint the panda as a highly-respected, wise, and totally non-cartoonish adviser.
Post by
Adamsm
But those vicious things still happened and were presented in a child-ish manner.
It is like how you said "people die horribly in Kingdom Hearts"
Doesn't stop it from being child-like.
Um......what? What is childish about Leonardo cutting of the head of the Shredder? And they actually show it, and the head landing on the ground and the body falls over....yes there is no blood(because of what the Shredder is in this version) but that was definitely not child friendly...at all. Welcome to the trope of talking about things you haven't seen.
Same as with the Unversed: Unlike Heartless and Nobodies, where there is a chance of coming back if the right circumstances are done; if you die to an Unversed, you are gone forever.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Atik
Um......what? What is childish about Leonardo cutting of the head of the Shredder? And they actually show it, and the head landing on the ground and the body falls over....yes there is no blood(because of what the Shredder is in this version) but that was definitely not child friendly...at all. Welcome to the trope of talking about things you haven't seen.
I've seen it. It is still child-like in its presentation.
Post by
OverZealous
I think as players we can see that Blizzard is trying to cater to the kids. "Mommy I want a Panda character. "
Maybe there will be more sales? If Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles wasn't taken I bet we might see a turtle race next? Martial arts seems to be selling....
Try reading some of the original TMNT comics. They weren't really intended for kids. Young adults, maybe, but not children.Heck, just look at TMNT 2K(the most recent revival); people died, were horribly disfigured, had massively vicious things happen to them...heck, I'll
let TVTropes
do the explaining.
But those vicious things still happened and were presented in a child-ish manner.
It is like how you said "people die horribly in Kingdom Hearts"
Doesn't stop it from being child-like.
It does not matter if they were presented in a childish manner; it is not a childish show if people are mutilated and people cutting off heads are shown on-screen. Or at least, it's not how I would define childish.
Post by
Adamsm
Um......what? What is childish about Leonardo cutting of the head of the Shredder? And they actually show it, and the head landing on the ground and the body falls over....yes there is no blood(because of what the Shredder is in this version) but that was definitely not child friendly...at all. Welcome to the trope of talking about things you haven't seen.
I've seen it. It is still child-like in its presentation.
......Uh huh; right.
It does not matter if they were presented in a childish manner; it is not a childish show if people are mutilated and people cutting off heads are shown on-screen. Or at least, it's not how I would define childish.
Perfect example: What happens to Baxter Stockman over the course of the series
; from a human, to a cripple, to a brain in a jar, to a zombie that falls apart, to a walking brain later in the series....yeah, kid friendly indeed....
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hymer
The popularity of an invalid argument - the popularity of anything - does not make it right. It just makes it popular.
True, but I don't see the relevance. WoW has long incorporated what was popular at the time, and there is nothing inherently wrong with that. Icecrown looks an awful lot like Peter jackson's Mordor springs to mind. Even the Lich King had considerable similarities with Sauron. Promotional material was cold, grim, skeletal, stark. Notice how in this one,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyeZ8khSEC0
the former expansions and vanilla have dramatic music and powerful evils. Suddenly things go quiet, and we get beautiful, quiet landscapes with exotic, but not frightening, architecture. And then we get a smiling pandaren monk, and we see them, well, dancing with smiles on their faces. It brings Kung-Fu Panda to mind, it did so with me, and I know Pandaren have existed in lore for quite some time, though they began as a throwaway joke.
The difference there is, LotR is not a children's movie. Kung-Fu Panda is. When people see Mordoresque architecture as a selling point, it caters to people somewhat older than when the selling point is pandas who fight for fun. Sure, there will be plenty of stuff for everyone, bound to be. There's plenty of silly stuff all over WoW, for people of all ages. Some serious stuff too, if you look in the right places. But it's still a fairly clear signal that things are more cute and less edgy than previosuly. And I don't think we're in the wrong for seeing that, and pointing it out.
What is happening is simple: hater's gonna hate.
http://www.wowhead.com/forums&topic=196603
About 48% declare that they love the expansion. Everyone else doesn't care, or has found something that rubs them the wrong way. Now, we don't have polling data, if you will, for the former expansions, but labeling 43% of those who voted (hate it or has some problems with it) as whiners and haters seems reckless. I don't label you a fanboi for defending the expansion. And I don't dismiss your opinion by calling you a 'whining vocal majority' either.
Post by
Adamsm
The difference there is, LotR is not a children's movie. Kung-Fu Panda is. When people see Mordoresque architecture as a selling point, it caters to people somewhat older than when the selling point is pandas who fight for fun. Sure, there will be plenty of stuff for everyone, bound to be. There's plenty of silly stuff all over WoW, for people of all ages. Some serious stuff too, if you look in the right places. But it's still a fairly clear signal that things are more cute and less edgy than previosuly. And I don't think we're in the wrong for seeing that, and pointing it out.
Well, personal preference there; a lot of the 'ooo so scary' moments of LotR seemed pretty childish to me. Of course, I guess I just don't see the 'inherent' silliness of the Pandarens....but that might be because of the fact that yes they are bear people...but then again, they are bear people who can probably tear you limb from limb just like their furbolg cousins.
Edit: Then again, I don't see a lot of what Peter Jackson does as 'scary', just over the top and slightly idiotic....the T-Rexes in King Kong? I was rooting for them to eat the annoying leading lady and to kick the ass of Kong. The giant bug scene? I was laughing my ass off, as were most of my friends, except for the one who has a phobia of insects.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hymer
For the last time, Pandaren are based off of China and so is Kung-Fu Panda. That makes them similar, but not based off one another.
Yeah. So? It's not a matter of copyrights, it's a matter of using public perception to make a good deal with your aging franchise in an economically trying time, where safe bets are very attractive. Why is that a problem?
Pandaria music isn't dramatic? A state of worldwide war between the world's largest factions equals to things going quiet? The world design must be frightening for it to take your breath away?
Try looking at the link. It's the very first thing you get, if you put Mists of Pandaria into the YouTube search. And notice the difference in tone between showing past expansions in it, and then MoP about half way through. It's very noticeable.
Well, personal preference there;
Of course, that is after all what we're talking about. And what we are all presenting here.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hymer
If they aren't based off one another, what proof do you have of that? And what proof do you have that it even matters? Other than supposed common sense, I ask you.
It's not an allegation. Why do I need proof? I'm saying "They're pretty savvy doing this", why do you see it as something negative?
Because this couldn't possibly be an effort to please the current fanbase... no one in their right mind has asked for pandaren! Oh wait, that isn't true.
I agree, Pandaren have been asked for for a long time. Again, Blizz are being pretty clever with this. And I don't mean that as an allegation either.
Rationalize it all you want but people have very personal reasons to dislike the theme of the expansion. I don't blame them for that, but I find it disgusting that they can't deal with it in a way other than the same old tired speech we get every. single. expansion.
'The game's dumbed down!' 'The expansion was made to appeal sci-fi fans!/kids!/pokemon fans!/some other group that for some reason would flock to WoW just because!' 'There's no Big Bad! The story officially sucks!' 'Talking pandas is so unrealistic' 'WOW WILL DIE!'
Why do you keep throwing these people in my face? I've said no such thing, and I'm not responsible for what others feel or how they choose to express themselves.
Personal reasons? What other reasons are there to talk about here?
Post by
588688
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
qwertydood
To answer the OP: Because of all the possibilities for a new expansion, an entire pandaren-based continent is pretty much the worst.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hymer
They are savvy, because they've hit a lot of good commercial spots here: They're targeting (what I'm informed is) the world's fastest growing consumer base, China. Especially after the trouble they had with WotLK, this makes perfect sense. They're throwing a healthy bite to a part of the existing fan base, in expanding on Pandaren. And they are doing this at a time, when talking animals + martial arts + (sort of) philosophy is doing well in a Western market. Talking animals for the younger crowd, martial arts for boys of all ages, and some philosophizing to give it that wise Eastern/Yoda feel for the mostly adult.
Granted, it is possible that nobody thought of any of this; that they just happened to hit these spots without thinking about it. But come on, give them some credit.
Post by
588688
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hymer
Opinion.
In
your
opinion.
This is all opinion, obviously.
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