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DW Frost DPS - Blowing Up the Competition One Obliterate At A Time

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Post by 178943

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Post by Spiattalo

Post by Eleazer

Post by 366136

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Post by Eleazer

Tankard is marginally better than Battlestar. I would say go for it, and get rid of the Crusader

Post by 366136

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Post by 345177

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Post by Spiattalo

Meta

Chaotic Skyflare - there is no other option

I don't know if anyone already pointed this out, but this statement is wrong. Relentless Skyflare Diamond is the gem to go with. You just activate it with one Nightmare Tear and then enjoy your new free spot for a Bold Cardinal Ruby.

You basically swap 20 Str, 21 Crit (and 30 Stam) for 30 Str, 31 Agi (and 10 Stam).

Went through this twice already and once again this is wrong. We are not Druids/Rogues/Hunters. The Agility modifier is much worse for us than a straight crit. Please take your misinformation back to the ret pali forums.

Ok. Let's calculate then.

Unholy stat weights:
Stat APE
Attack Power 1.0
Weapon Speed 238.10
Weapon DPS 6.03
Hit Rating (until cap) 3.05
Strength 3.05
Crit Rating w/ 4P T9 2.22
Haste Rating 2.19
Expertise Rating 1.65
Crit rating w/o 4P T9 1.60
Agility w/ 4P T9 1.50
Hit Rating (to spell hit cap) 1.40
Armor Penetration 1.30
Agility w/o 4P T9 1.05

So, with the agi meta gem we have + = 124,05 AP
With the crit meta gem we have + = 93 AP

So clearly the agi meta gem beat the crit one for unholy. Let's continue.

Blood weight stats:
Stat APE
Attack Power 1
Weapon DPS 9.89
Strength 2.89
Armor Penetration 2.75
Hit Rating (to cap) 2.51
Expertise Rating 2.47
Crit Rating 1.56
Haste Rating 1.5
Agility 1.37
Hit Rating (to spell hit cap) .52
Armor .03

Agi meta gem: + = 129,17 AP
Crit meta gem: + = 89,96 AP

Even for Blood DKs the agi meta is better. But this is a Frost sticky, so let's calculate again.

Frost stat weights (0/53/18):
Stat APE
AttackPower 1
Strength 2.68
Agility 1.42
CritRating 1.84
HasteRating 1.26
ArmorPenetrationRating 1.58
ExpertiseRating 2.97
BeforeMeleeHitCap<8% 3.52
SpellHitRating 0.99
WeaponDPS 6.77
WeaponSpeed 258.06
After spell hit cap 0.80

Agi meta gem: + = 123 AP
Crit meta gem: + post-3.2, due to its low requirements Relentless Earthsiege Diamond is the best meta gem. Generally this is activated with a Nightmare Tear.

And you may be right.
But seriously, I doubt it.

Edit: All stat weights are taken from EJ spec-specific threads. No Retri stuff there.

Post by 474779

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Post by Spiattalo

You don't get his point. It's not because of AP why the crit one is better, but it's because you don't get spell crit from agility... And HB works on spell crit. In Unholy too, DC works on spell crit. So do your math again.

Erm... those stat weights already consider that.

As for your answer, 2 diseases rotation > 1 disease rotation.

Post by Eleazer

I have read EJ's post on it, and it has more to do with the low requirements based on the need one yellow one red gem. However, it is not better in terms of total output. They have no math that states otherwise, it has more to do with ease of gearing than optimal dps output. I have no desire to go around changing to the agility one despite your constant badgering. 21 crit factors in better of our overall dps output.

I will however add the gem with a disclaimer.

"Some information has been brought forward claiming this gem can also be used. I have not seen even a marginal dps increase based on this gem. It is much simpler to gear with gem as it only requires the use of one Nightmare Tear."

On a side note, Elitist Jerks also promotes a build that ignores UBA and puts points in Hungering Cold just to skip on putting points into IIT. Not only is this build just awful, but it ignores any desire by the player to be useful in a raid so I declined to put the build in the list. It is a selfish build built for a selfish player, and will not help promote in any way. Any build without UBA is just ignorant. Despite their claims that it is the maximum dps build I have yet to see a DW frost dk do more with it.

Please read the disclaimer at the top. This is not the be-all end-all guide, it is a help for those who wish to pve with their DK. It's my personal opinion and facts based on what I have done and read.

Post by Spiattalo

I have read EJ's post on it, and it has more to do with the low requirements based on the need one yellow one red gem. However, it is not better in terms of total output. They have no math that states otherwise, it has more to do with ease of gearing than optimal dps output. I have no desire to go around changing to the agility one despite your constant badgering. 21 crit factors in better of our overall dps output.

I will however add the gem with a disclaimer.

"Some information has been brought forward claiming this gem can also be used. I have not seen even a marginal dps increase based on this gem. It is much simpler to gear with gem as it only requires the use of one Nightmare Tear."

On a side note, Elitist Jerks also promotes a build that ignores UBA and puts points in Hungering Cold just to skip on putting points into IIT. Not only is this build just awful, but it ignores any desire by the player to be useful in a raid so I declined to put the build in the list.

Please read the disclaimer at the top. This is not the be-all end-all guide, it is a help for those who wish to pve with their DK. It's my personal opinion and facts based on what I have done and read.

Well, you stated mine was a misinformation, I proved it wasn't. That gem is better as far as both dps and meta requirements are concerned, and I see no maths confirming the Crit one is better.

Post by 178943

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Post by 243785

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Post by Spiattalo

Then where are the maths proving your Agi one is better?

Are you serious? I just did the maths 2 posts upward...

Post by 410715

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Post by 378676

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Post by Spiattalo

Just to cut it down, it was to point out that there is an alternative to the crit meta gem, unlike what Eleazer said.

This is a very good primer which just missed that info and that's it.

What you could argue about is which of the 2 is better. Actually there's no argument though, as the agi one provides more dps overall; singularly taken the crit one is better than the agi one, but, seriously, who cares? If you do dps you want to do as much dps as possible and there's no reason apart being greedy not to take the agi meta gem.

@Clydtsdk: The point is not the socket bonus, although that's a nice bonus. The point is that you need 2 non-red gem to activate the crit meta, while just one to activate the agi meta.