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Post by
markosias
So recently my brother specced protribution for some PVE test and pulled around 3kdps in new 5man heroics, which i find remarkable for his gear. With a prot paly doing dps, I decided to crunch some numbers, check some abilities and see if a Ret paly could, with proper gear, tank.
Most of you are laughing now, I know, but comparing abilities to a DK it seems pretty similar.
Deathknight Paladin
----------Talents-------------------
Frost Presence-6%stam, 60%armor Imp.Devo Aura- 2kArmor-2%bonus healing
8%damage reduction Righteous Fury-6% damage reduction
Anticipation-5%DODGE \\\\\ Anticipation-5%DODGE
Toughness-10%armor,-30%slow \\\\\\ Toughness-10%armor,-30%slow
BladeBarrier-5% damage reduction\\\ Deflection-5% Dodge
Weapon Spec-4%meleeDmg \\\\\ WpnSpec-6%MeleeDmg
DarkCon,B.V.-5-11%crit \\\\\\ HoC,Conviction,SoB, 11%crit
Imp.Deathstrike \\\\\\\\ Art of War, Sheath of Light
Vet.3rdWar-6%str,3%stam,6expert \\\\\ Kings-10% str, agil, int, stam
Abom.Might-2%str,10%AP \\\\\\\\\ Vengence-3-9%bonus damage
Vampiric Blood-35%healing, 15%hp\\\\\\\ Divinity-5%healing
HeartStrike-slow \\\\\\ DivineStorm-Heals
BloodGorged-10%AP \\\\\\ Swift Retribution-3%haste
Magic Shield \\\\\\ Divine Purpose-4%spelldodge
--------conclusion----------------------
Dodge 5 \ 5 tied
Parry \ 5 Paly
DmgRedux 8+5 \ 6+3 DK
Armor 60+10 \ 2k+10%+ DK
Str 6+2 \ 10+ Paly
Stam 6+3 \ 10% Paly
Agil
HP 15 \ DK
Heals \ 5% Paly
Crit 5-11 \ 11 Paly
Dmg 4+ \ 39+6+ Paly
expert 6 \ DK
AP 10+10 \ DK
+Heals 25selfheal \ 3k Meh
Haste \ 3% Paly
---------------------Analysis-----------------------------------
DKs still have better damage redux, by about 4% which is a relativly heft number. Palys do have more stamina to compensate, along with 5% more healing on them, and Parry. Expertise is lacking for the paladin, but I believe easily compensated for with a glyph.
this is the spec im using for these calculations. along with glyphs
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#sZx0xA0bZxf0trIuGbofsu:pGkcm
--Gear--
Still compiling a setup of gear, think DK tank gear with a good +hit two hander.
So any of you pro tanks wanna give it a shot, leave feedback, or ways to improve it?
-Palyndrome
Post by
Quest
Its not remarkable, its normal. Ret Tank is only ok if you have a healer to carry you.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
Deflection-5%
Dodge
Parry
DarkCon,
B.V.
Subversion
-5-11%crit \\\\\\ HoC,Conviction,SoB, 11%crit
Vet.3rdWar-6%str,3%stam,6expert \\\\\ Kings-10% str, agil, int, stam
Nil point if there is another paladin or
Drums of Forgotten Kings
Abom.Might-2%str,10%AP
Bloody Vengeance
\\\\\\\\\ Vengence-3-9%bonus damage
And so on, too many things to fix for me to go through it all.
If you're determined to tank as ret, something like
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#sZV0tubhZxf0tbIuhdIcsu
would be better.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
SlowSide
1) 3K DPS in heroics even as tank isn't amazing, I normally do about 2500 full prot w/ SoW.
2) You better have good healers & warn them.
3) You will be taking larger & more hits, the shield makes a big difference from block, armor, and health.
I have done something similar, Prot gear + Ret Spec, 2H, ret rings / trinkets. I have done OT for our weekly raid a couple times like this, and done 1 Heroic. Even with good healers, 550 def, 50% avoidance & 35k HP it isn't pleasant or worth it. I played with gear a little, IE stam trinkets, ret / prot gear mix, none of it matters, NOTHING can replace a good shield for a tanking pally.
Post by
322464
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Silversmith
For ilvl200 heroics: ret spec, ret gear. The faster you kill it, the less damage it will do to you.
If both you and your healer overgear the instance, it is a fast and fun way to do it. Otherwise, leave tanking to proper tanks.
Post by
AnrDaemon
Only 3k? I'm pulling 3-3.5 in pure prot spec... and prot gear, what no less important.
In more DPS-heavy set i'm closing 4k, and I yet to find my T10 pieces coming. Just a badge gear.
Post by
AldaranStormrage
I have a friend who tanks heroics on his rogue. Dodge trinkets, rings and amulet. He tanked Occulus with no problems. He says it's easier and quicker than worrying about his aggro :P
I've tanked a few heroics as ret when doing it with guildies because things die so fast there is no point in respeccing.
Post by
slasher0161
I have a friend who tanks heroics on his rogue. Dodge trinkets, rings and amulet. He tanked Occulus with no problems. He says it's easier and quicker than worrying about his aggro :P
I've tanked a few heroics as ret when doing it with guildies because things die so fast there is no point in respeccing.
things might die quick, but i just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. You wouldn't be able to do runs at anywhere near the same speed as a properly spec'd and geared tank would.
Post by
AldaranStormrage
I have a friend who tanks heroics on his rogue. Dodge trinkets, rings and amulet. He tanked Occulus with no problems. He says it's easier and quicker than worrying about his aggro :P
I've tanked a few heroics as ret when doing it with guildies because things die so fast there is no point in respeccing.
things might die quick, but i just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. You wouldn't be able to do runs at anywhere near the same speed as a properly spec'd and geared tank would.
Actually he tanked it so we could get
Make It Count
and that was long before the Occulus nerfs probably just after 3.2 came out. Finished it in 17 minutes. iirc he also tanked
Less-Rabi
for us :P
Aside from that I agree with you, it's just so we can mix things up and have some fun. It is a game after all ^_^
Post by
biogoo
The other priest in my guild told me he got a holy paladin for occulus that just healed himself with righteous fury and kept aggro that way. Much neater imo :P
Thats what I do:o)
Even as healer...
The tank either desperately tries to grab aggro back (doable only by taunting, but I have taunts too, hh), or just sits behind waiting for us to wipe... sadly, BoL allows me to receive full heals while healing random party damage too, so no wiping:o)
Well, I do it usualy when the tank goes afk or is generaly slow, or is a DK. My guild main tank hates it too, but, well, he is the one who comes in full ret spec/gear and tanks with that...
You know, what matters is the shield. No healer should mind if you get hit 9 times out of 10, unless he is incapacitated by some dungeon mechanics, but what matters is the amount of damage you take, and the armor from shield realy counts (if I healtank, I cant block/dodge/parry, but I have the armor contribution at least).
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