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Anyone hate relying on demonic teleporter?
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Post by
488155
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Post by
340720
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Post by
Onijitsu
Shoot man, I can't wait to get teleportation ability. (I'm at 79, with 90% XP, woo!)
True, it doesn't let you set a destination the way you could with a Sorceress in Diablo II, but that's not really a bad thing. It's a powerful ability. Having to set a destination by going there first may seem a little inconvenient, but it lets you pick spots (like places that're behind objects, as kilo points out) which mages just cannot blink to. And, at a
50% farther
distance than they can Blink.
If you could pick
just anyplace
to teleport to -- like say, atop buildings in Warsong Gulch -- then it seems to me that Demonic Teleport would be far too destabilizing in PvP situations. All we need is a bazillion other non-Locks screaming for another nerf.
I expect that, after I get teleportation ability, tomorrow or the next day, I'll prolly be using it in Orgrimmar to get between the AH and bank for awhile. ;-)
Post by
asakawa
i hate to say it but any warlock who hates their teleport is a baaaad warlock.
Post by
Fingulfin
i hate to say it but any warlock who hates their teleport is a baaaad warlock.
Amen.
Post by
154418
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Post by
413955
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Post by
Onijitsu
I just went and surveyed the unique abilities which each class finally gets when they ding 80. No egregious offense is intended to anyone who owns any non-Warlock toons, but I did want to make a point by direct comparison. I am aware that each class has some pretty cool abilities. But, these are supposedly the light at the end of that leveling tunnel. (And, some of these "lights" seem pretty dim.)
Death Knights
-
Army of the Dead
I think this one is actually pretty cool. But, DKs are prevented from using this in Arenas.
Druids
-
Nourish
I suppose it allows for greater survivability, which is great in PvP? Or, it allows them to be a better support-character. But this one doesn't blow my skirt up at all. (Note: I'm not hatin' on Healers at all. I just don't think this is a "prize" comparable to some of the others)
Hunters
-
Call Stabled Pet
Whatever! Warlocks can start switchin' out at level 10. (When they have their second minion!) I think the only thing Hunters have over us on pets is the ability to name their buddy -- we have
minions
-- and a certain amount of greater selection. But, they also have a buttload of bugs related to their pets. Some of which have supposedly been around as "known issues" for awhile. And this ability can also NOT be used in Arena combat!
Mages
-
Mirror Image
Okay, this one is absolutely awesome. Not just cosmetic, it also boosts a Mage's DPS for awhile, without costing them extra spellpower. Seems to me that we Warlocks more naturally fit the classic RPG "illusionist" concept -- especially, with our fearing capabilities -- but our cousins prolly deserve a little love for all the Warlock Envy QQing.
Paladins
-
Sacred Shield
My wife is a Paladin. She wasn't excited about this one at all. It's interesting, but like some of the others, it seems to send the message, "For your graduation, you get to be a better support character!"
Priests
-
Divine Hymn
&
Hymn of Hope
The Priests get two! Good for that oft-beleaguered class. Priests are built, from the ground up, to be excellent Healers anyway. Unless, they want to play Shadow DPS. But, this helps them to better fulfill their primary role in the game.
Rogues
-
Fan of Knives
One of the Rogues' only two AoE abilities.
Shamans
-
Hex
Basically Polymorph, without the healing effect. And, it supposedly doesn't break quite so easily, which is a plus, but it also only lasts 30 seconds to a Mage's 50 seconds. (I find it ironic that Mage polymorphing heals, and that Shaman polymorphing doesn't)
Warlocks
-
Demonic Circle: Summon
&
Demonic Circle: Teleport
.
One might consider these two as one spell.
Warriors
-
Heroic Throw
30 yard range. Instant Cast. Talented, it can silence its target for 3 seconds. So, not bad. Not stellar, but not bad for a melee class. Warriors probably love this.
One or two of these are interesting and worthy of some side-by-side comparison, but the rest seem to lack the sheer coolness and versatility of Demonic Circle.
Post by
skribs
See I could look at that breakdown completely different:
Army of the Dead: An ability which results in the taunt-trick (e.g. pop it, wait 10 sec, taunt, and you have 400k threat) on 5-mans, or which is a nice DPS increase in raids.
Nourish: The only true direct heal a druid will use at 80 and is why my druid was topping the healing meters when I was only healing a tank.
Call Stable Pet: Great ability regardless of the level. The fact that it should be trainable at 10 is not a flaw in the ability, but rather in levelling mechanics.
Sacred Shield: Doesn't seem that good, but for 5-mans or 2-tank healing this is very powerful. Not so much for the shield itself (although the shield is great) but for the 50% crit on FoL as well as the HoT.
Although I will agree that I want the demonic circle. There are too many times I've seen it used properly in PvP or PvE to where I said "I wish I was on a lock."
Post by
Onijitsu
Oh sure. I'm not saying these abilities aren't useful. I'm sure they're VERY useful. (Except, maybe Call Stabled Pet... which, is useful, but we seem to agree that it's pretty limp for an ability you would only get at level 80!)
I just don't think all of these have the same coolness factor that would motivate a prospective player to decide, "I want to level a all the way up to 80 for that!" Most of these are useful in very specific, but also more limited ways. Whereas, DC is a great talent to have in both PvE and PvP. Or, for just dinking around a city for awhile.
I'm considering leveling a Druid or a Priest in a bit, and trying the healing role as an alternate to killing everything. I guess that, as a Druid, I'd hope for something better than a sexy new healing spell. Like, the ability to shapeshift into something really fun. (Perhaps, becoming a doppleganger of someone or something else for awhile, in order to temporarily gain some ability of that creature's... Why not? Hunters gain extra abilities through choosing their pets)
If Demonic Circle weren't on the list, I would probably pick Mirror Image or Army of the Dead as the most interesting alternatives.
Post by
asakawa
i think you're attaching far too much significance to these abilities.
with 3.0 came extended talent trees, that meant a lot of new talents and
they
are the main things which were added to the game with 3.0. the level 80 abilities are necessarily more limited just by the nature of them being available to all specs in that class.
they're cool but if anyone is in need of a cool ability to give them the drive to hit 80 then they're REALLY not levelling for the right reasons and they WILL be very disappointed.
i think that coming to the game post-wrath gives a very different point of view on the game. remember that it has been in development since 2004 and the level 80 stuff was just another step along the road.
Post by
413955
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Post by
Barkend
Demonic Circle = indoor immortallity
L2 use it
Post by
Onijitsu
Onijitsu, putting melee, cc's, and healer attributes in your comparison with demonic teleport is like comparing lettuce with fruit.
Like it or not, the fruit and veggies are all in the same salad. (to continue your metaphor)
But, I have to admit you have a point. Each class has its role(s).
Hunter - Fain Death
Mage - Blink
Lock - Demonic Teleport
These three abilities are worthy of comparison in the context of DPS abilities to avoid problems in PvE. I'm speaking from a different context.
(p.s. -- Does Feign Death impart many advantages in PvP?)
i think you're attaching far too much significance to these abilities.
with 3.0 came extended talent trees, that meant a lot of new talents and
they
are the main things which were added to the game with 3.0. the level 80 abilities are necessarily more limited just by the nature of them being available to all specs in that class.
they're cool but if anyone is in need of a cool ability to give them the drive to hit 80 then they're REALLY not levelling for the right reasons and they WILL be very disappointed.
i think that coming to the game post-wrath gives a very different point of view on the game. remember that it has been in development since 2004 and the level 80 stuff was just another step along the road.
Well, let me step back and clarify my position from the viewpoint of game design philosophy. What makes gamers go, "Wow, I wanna play that game!" And, what thought processes go into the design of a game to make it exciting, interesting and addicting like that.
How many of you played
Diablo I
and
II
? The concept was fairly simple, compared to many games today, but both games were a huge hit. You kill stuff, you get loot and XP. You get enough loot, you can buy/sell/trade for things you want. You get enough XP, you level up. Both games were built around small-cycle immediate gratification (kill -> loot), medium-cycle gratification (leveling up, the gaining of new abilities and weapons, and entering new areas), and a larger, overarching story. Which, also became cyclic, because very few of us stopped playing either game after getting through it the first time. We were addicted. Once you killed Big-D at each level of difficulty, you even got a title in front of your name while on the Battle.net chat area. Bragging rights.
How many of you guys played
Halo 2
? *show of hands*
How many of you guys liked the ending? (It was a bit disappointing and anticlimactic, wasn't it?)
In each phase of World of Warcraft, there is/was an "endgame" or level-cap at 60, 70 and 80. Once you reach the level-cap, it's no longer about leveling up, but a number of other things. Obtaining new and better gear. Fine-tuning your character and your own skills to be better in raiding and PvP. Maybe, finishing up your professions. Maybe, collecting pets, mounts, titles and achievements is your fancy. Maybe even rolling a new alt, and starting the climb again. In each phase, Blizzard paid a lot of attention to giving people something to do, once they reached the level cap, because they didn't want their customers getting bored. And, they apparently got better with each new version of WoW. Engaged and excited gamers are loyal, paying gamers.
Each phase of WoW -- especially, the expansion packs, BC and WotLK -- brought new items, new areas, new quests, new enemies, and new abilities and talents. And my point is that, with good game design, each stopping point (60/70/80) would have been created to be exciting and challenging at the time.
And so, absolutely, the abilities you receive by
each
level-cap (Vanilla, BC, WotLK) are worthy of comparison. Even, between different classes. And it's arguable (rightly so) that, just getting to 60/70/80 ought to be exciting in and of itself. But, if you're not excited about what Blizzard is giving you, and not excited about what Blizzard may give you next, then they have failed somewhere along the way. It's a game, after all.
Post by
Chinky
i hate to say it but any warlock who hates their teleport is a baaaad warlock.
Ourah!
Post by
108118
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skribs
Actually, Onijutsu, the "reward" for hitting level 80 isn't primarily the skill you unlock, but rather the options available to you. You aren't doing Arena or Raids at level 79, and if you are it's old-world raids or skirmishes only. Progression raiding content and rated arena matches (the only two forms of "official" progression at 80 for a team/guild) are available when you hit 80. When my paladin hit 80, it wasn't "look I got Sacred Shield!" it was "Okay now I can gear up to heal." When my hunter hit 80 it wasn't "oh look, I got CSP!" it was "okay, time to get my PvP set!" Similarly, when I hit 80 on my warlock I'll be excited about DC, but the goal of hitting 80 isn't for DC but to gear up my warlock for raid DPS - which then raid DPS becomes the focus after that.
Hitting level 80 isn't the end of the game, it's the start of the game. It's like in Diablo 2 - when you hit level 99, you just got to put another rank on another spell or get rank 1 of a spell you didn't have before. Anything past 30 you didn't unlock anything new. Even then, for some classes, the spells you looked forward to most were gotten at level 12 or 18 (honestly, except for the passive damage increase on my aura or the defense from holy shield; my zealadin was practically done with his active skills by level 15 by having rank 4 of zeal).
Post by
Onijitsu
Actually, Onijutsu, the "reward" for hitting level 80 isn't primarily the skill you unlock, but rather the options available to you. Hitting level 80 isn't the end of the game, it's the start of the game.
I
did
cover this.
And yeah, I
also
covered the fact that each class has some really cool abilities, which they do get at different times. I've kinda been coveting the Shammy's Ghost Wolf form for a bit, which they get at level 16. Warlocks get soulstones at level 18. I was
excited
to discover that. Death Knights get the game-changing ability to harpoon others almost immediately. Mages can teleport/portal, create their own food 'n water, and can iceblock and/or go invisible to deal with a lot of different situations.
Are you suggesting you
never
got excited about something you picked up along the way, with any of the classes you've played? And you're right, CSP and Sacred Shield aren't things I'd be excited about at endgame either. But Paladins and Hunters don't necessarily fit my playstyle either.
However you want to slice it, Demonic Circle is just one of the coolest and more unique abilities in the game. I definitely don't think it's anything I ever expected to see any Warlock
complaining about
in the least.
Post by
Aladael
Portal = win
Like when in a group in dalaran with people in your multi-person mount, ride throught the sewers to the exit pipe, where you previously set your portal. Then drive off, Port-up in mid-air and /lol.
Post by
skribs
I do agree I get excited about new abilities. But any ability at any level pales in comparison to being level 80 and having the complete arsenal; as well as being able to do end-game content.
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