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So how about making WoW hard again?
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Post by
soccergenius
You're right, my comments don't adress the OP. Having said that, I never meant to imply that addons are a crutch for terrible players, I even admitted to using one that I find invaluable for enh shamans; you put a lot of words in my mouth. I use addons, everyone uses addons.
My point was that if the game is too easy it's because you made it easy through addons , guides, and the choice to not do hardmodes. But as you pointed out, that's not really in the scope of this thread.
Post by
44284
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Post by
161859
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Post by
lonewarrior
I would be all in favor of no addons...providing Blizz incorporated necessary ones into their system. Some people have to play with all setting set on minimum. Using visual cues of a bosses action would make it extremely difficult without written warnings.
Post by
Sigmafel
I would be all in favor of no addons...providing Blizz incorporated necessary ones into their system. Some people have to play with all setting set on minimum. Using visual cues of a bosses action would make it extremely difficult without written warnings.
There are no "necessary" add-ons. They are quality of life add-ons.
Personally, I even find DBM to be quite intrusive.
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44284
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Post by
292516
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Post by
HoleofArt
You posted your comment after 19 pages of discussion that has been through all that, along with many other things.
GG for the relevant post?
Post by
292516
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Post by
HoleofArt
Never knew how to do that. Thanks.
Post by
lonewarrior
I would be all in favor of no addons...providing Blizz incorporated necessary ones into their system. Some people have to play with all setting set on minimum. Using visual cues of a bosses action would make it extremely difficult without written warnings.
There are no "necessary" add-ons. They are quality of life add-ons.
Personally, I even find DBM to be quite intrusive.
On the contrary, there are. If for instant a boss does an AoE effect on the ground under him for let's say 30yrds that you have to move away from...someone with video settings set to low might not be able to visual see correctly when he is out of the AoE danger zone...something telling that person he had moved beyond 30 yards from target (IE. Range display addon) would be needed.
Also distance from another players is incorporated into many of the mechanics of boss fights..not being able to tell how far away you are from other players would make for quite a bit of havoc.
Post by
Sigmafel
I would be all in favor of no addons...providing Blizz incorporated necessary ones into their system. Some people have to play with all setting set on minimum. Using visual cues of a bosses action would make it extremely difficult without written warnings.
There are no "necessary" add-ons. They are quality of life add-ons.
Personally, I even find DBM to be quite intrusive.
On the contrary, there are. If for instant a boss does an AoE effect on the ground under him for let's say 30yrds that you have to move away from...someone with video settings set to low might not be able to visual see correctly when he is out of the AoE danger zone...something telling that person he had moved beyond 30 yards from target (IE. Range display addon) would be needed.
Also distance from another players is incorporated into many of the mechanics of boss fights..not being able to tell how far away you are from other players would make for quite a bit of havoc.
Again, quality of life - you don't have to eyeball distance to players because an addon tells you almost exactly the actual distance. There's a lot of things we take for granted that we honestly shouldn't with DBM and all the cool add-ons we do have. Yes, Blizzard's default UI is kind of bad, but like all add-ons, DBM is a crutch. If Blizzard enforced raiding without add-ons, we'd be able to see what is really necessary, but I'll contend that, at the normal raiding level at least, nothing really is.
Now, I'll not argue the video settings one - I've raided on a crappy computer, but projected textures (aka the fire on the ground) is a must be turned on kind of deal. You can't turn it on? Think twice about raiding, your machine may get murdered in the attempt.
Post by
lonewarrior
I would be all in favor of no addons...providing Blizz incorporated necessary ones into their system. Some people have to play with all setting set on minimum. Using visual cues of a bosses action would make it extremely difficult without written warnings.
There are no "necessary" add-ons. They are quality of life add-ons.
Personally, I even find DBM to be quite intrusive.
On the contrary, there are. If for instant a boss does an AoE effect on the ground under him for let's say 30yrds that you have to move away from...someone with video settings set to low might not be able to visual see correctly when he is out of the AoE danger zone...something telling that person he had moved beyond 30 yards from target (IE. Range display addon) would be needed.
Also distance from another players is incorporated into many of the mechanics of boss fights..not being able to tell how far away you are from other players would make for quite a bit of havoc.
Again, quality of life - you don't have to eyeball distance to players because an addon tells you almost exactly the actual distance. There's a lot of things we take for granted that we honestly shouldn't with DBM and all the cool add-ons we do have. Yes, Blizzard's default UI is kind of bad, but like all add-ons, DBM is a crutch. If Blizzard enforced raiding without add-ons, we'd be able to see what is really necessary, but I'll contend that, at the normal raiding level at least, nothing really is.
Now, I'll not argue the video settings one - I've raided on a crappy computer, but projected textures (aka the fire on the ground) is a must be turned on kind of deal. You can't turn it on? Think twice about raiding, your machine may get murdered in the attempt.
If you can visual tell how far away you are from other members in a raid during a crucial spot on a flat screen monitor without a range box...then I tip my hat to your eyes...mine are not as good.
You forget particle density as well, which give substance to that fire on the ground. Set to low you might think your out of it when your not.
Post by
93865
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Post by
538827
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Post by
prollfin
You're not grasping the parameters of the discussion. We're talking about the game as known to the playerbase in general, not the minority of hardcore raiders - the game that lets terrible players leech and get gear and drag down players who are actually trying, but don't have any better options than to run with them.
That's an important point. Why would a "decent" player - who happens to run with a group of people who don't even try - turn off his addons to make the game more challenging? To try to be just as bad as them? Is this supposed to be fun?
As long as there are numerous options to customize the UI, not taking advantage of that is... well... pardon my french... stupid. Not caring about addons is one thing, but not using addons although you know how they can help you to be more efficient and effective is a whole different thing.
I agree that using as many resources as possible is part of being "skilled". Capping yourself doesn't make sense unless you only want to make a point - like when playing ICC10 in blues.
In the end, playing without addons is almost the same as not getting gear upgrades although they're available - or like not walking out of the fire although you
could
- or like dropping your elitist-approved spec in favor of some "my cousin says it's good" spec.
Post by
lonewarrior
Where addons are concerned..any that improve over Blizz original UI design, I think is fine.
But there were some out there like AVRE which practically played your toon for you and I was aware of some guilds that required raid members to have it installed. These types of addons definitely crossed the line.
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