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Christian Church Qur'an Burning
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
There's freedom of speech.... then there's intentionally stirring up a hornet's nest to cause $%^& and conflict just to get yourself publicity.
And who gets to determine and judge intent?
When the Freedom of Speech comments are designed to focus and attack a certain religious group or creed, and even worse, targets a group 'known' for violent retribution...yeah....plus, the Pastor in question is a racist bigoted jack ass. It's a thin line after all.
You didn't answer the question.
Post by
Heckler
There's freedom of speech.... then there's intentionally stirring up a hornet's nest to cause $%^& and conflict just to get yourself publicity.
And who gets to determine and judge intent?
The person who does the action.
Post by
Adamsm
You didn't answer the question.
Best bet would be someone higher up in the Church for him particularly, but other then that, someone within the Government I suppose; again though, because of what the Pastor was calling for.
Post by
Kibbles
If we spent half of the resources and effort into helping them achieve that level of prosperity, instead of bombing them, shooting them, and creating generations of muslims who'll hold life-long (and in many cases entirely justified) grudges against the West in general and the US in particular we might be able to bridge this divide. One unmanned drone taking out a wedding party trumps burning a library full of holy books.
You honestly believe this. Let me get this right- You honestly believe that we should give money to a religion in which several nations-
1.) Are at war with us (Until recently Iraq, Afghanistan)
2.) Knowingly harbor terrorists (Afghanistan, Pakistan) that kill more than twenty thousand each year?
3.) Are hostile towards us and Israel just because Israel was formed. Tied yourself in a knot, didn't you? Should we have saved a religion by displacing thousands and antagonizing us against a religion, or let that religion be persecuted to near-death?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
There's freedom of speech.... then there's intentionally stirring up a hornet's nest to cause $%^& and conflict just to get yourself publicity.
And who gets to determine and judge intent?
The person who does the action.
I'm not sure how that works. The law is "freedom of speech is protected" or some such idea. Adamsm seems to want to classify things as not freedom of speech, and thus, I assume, not protected. So who determines that? It's a self defeating distinction if anybody can decide if their own speech is free or not.
Best bet would be someone higher up in the Church for him particularly, but other then that, someone within the Government I suppose; again though, because of what the Pastor was calling for.
You seem to be making a legal claim. Best bet isn't going to cut it for me. I don't like arbitrary laws.
...
Going to mass, bbl.
Post by
Heckler
If we spent half of the resources and effort into helping them achieve that level of prosperity, instead of bombing them, shooting them, and creating generations of muslims who'll hold life-long (and in many cases entirely justified) grudges against the West in general and the US in particular we might be able to bridge this divide. One unmanned drone taking out a wedding party trumps burning a library full of holy books.
You honestly believe this. Let me get this right- You honestly believe that we should give money to a religion in which several nations-
1.) Are at war with us (Until recently Iraq, Afghanistan)
2.) Knowingly harbor terrorists (Afghanistan, Pakistan) that kill more than twenty thousand each year?
3.) Are hostile towards us and Israel just because Israel was formed. Tied yourself in a knot, didn't you? Should we have saved a religion by displacing thousands and antagonizing us against a religion, or let that religion be persecuted to near-death?
If you're willing to make ignorant generalizations like you just did, you could construct a similar list for just about every religion in the world.
Post by
Heckler
I'm not sure how that works. The law is "freedom of speech is protected" or some such idea. Adamsm seems to want to classify things as not freedom of speech, and thus, I assume, not protected. So who determines that? It's a self defeating distinction if anybody can decide if their own speech is free or not.
I would tend to agree with you on this point, I don't think you could make a successful freedom of speech claim against this pastor. But, as an example, you can't yell FIRE! in a crowded theater, so not
all
speech is protected.
My point was simply that the only person who can truly know intention is the person who carries out the action. But, this pastor hasn't made a secret about the motivations or intent of his actions, however, so a 3rd party judge is not necessary.
Post by
Adamsm
Best bet would be someone higher up in the Church for him particularly, but other then that, someone within the Government I suppose; again though, because of what the Pastor was calling for.
You seem to be making a legal claim. Best bet isn't going to cut it for me. I don't like arbitrary laws.
Going to mass, bbl.
Later HSR. And I merely said what I know of the American Legal system; which isn't deep or the like so yeah, two cents and all that.
But, as an example, you can't yell FIRE! in a crowded theater, so not all speech is protected.Which is what the Pastor is attempting to do.
Post by
135207
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Orranis
If we spent half of the resources and effort into helping them achieve that level of prosperity, instead of bombing them, shooting them, and creating generations of muslims who'll hold life-long (and in many cases entirely justified) grudges against the West in general and the US in particular we might be able to bridge this divide. One unmanned drone taking out a wedding party trumps burning a library full of holy books.
You honestly believe this. Let me get this right- You honestly believe that we should give money to a
religion
in which several nations-
1.) Are at war with us (Until recently Iraq, Afghanistan)
2.) Knowingly harbor terrorists (Afghanistan, Pakistan) that kill more than twenty thousand each year?
3.) Are hostile towards us and Israel just because Israel was formed. Tied yourself in a knot, didn't you? Should we have saved a religion by displacing thousands and antagonizing us against a religion, or let that religion be persecuted to near-death?
...I have no words. We are not at war with any religion. No set of belief's can harbor anything. No set of belief's created at least a thousand year's ago can be hostile towards us.
And don't even start on the Israel thing, you obviously know nothing on the subject.
Just remember that Jew's aren't the only people who can be displaced and persecuted. In fact, that's exactly what Israel did to thousands when it settled.
Post by
574857
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DraconisAerius
imo religion started out as a way for greedy people to make money and ever since it has just been used as justification to kill people. I don't know if any of that religious stuff is real, I don't care either, but I think it's bad because of the way the system can be abused.
Post by
Monday
imo religion started out as a way for greedy people to make money and ever since it has just been used as justification to kill people. I don't know if any of that religious stuff is real, I don't care either, but I think it's bad because of the way the system can be abused.
Meh. I think atheists who think they'll die and turn to nothing are horrible, because they don't care what they do and have a lack of morals.
cwatididthar?
Post by
Orranis
imo religion started out as a way for greedy people to make money and ever since it has just been used as justification to kill people. I don't know if any of that religious stuff is real, I don't care either, but I think it's bad because of the way the system can be abused.
I disagree. Religion started as a great way to gift moral's upon the masses in the days early. Unfortunately, it was too set in stone and now that morality has shifted some, creates much controversy. I just don't think it's needed in the modern world, but I don't mind it as long as it's made 'pure' again.
Post by
327953
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Post by
138638
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
240135
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
374287
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
240135
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
Alright, so it's a blog post from a
webcomic
(starts under the Kaiju Grrl pics):
(NSFW)
Ok, now it's time to rant.
As you know, I hold the First Amendment to be sacred. However, too many of you @#$%ing morons use it as a shield to protect what you think is your God-given right to act like ^&*!ing morons. I'm talking to you
Laura Schlessinger
, as well as other pig$%^&ers across this great nation of ours.
Let's look at the amendment in question:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Let me spell it out for the @#$%ing illiterate. The government will not make any law preventing you from saying what you want. However, nowhere in there does it say that they will protect you from your own stupidity.
In otherwords, you can't shout "FIRE" in a crowded theater, and you can't shout "N****R" in a crowded Best Buy. Oh, you CAN, but is someone starts whipping your ass, you can't say your First Amendment Rights are being violated. Your ASS is being violated, that's it.
So when you say N****R N****R N****R N****R N****R N****R N****R, and you're white, you don't get to hide behind the First Amendment for your %^&*ed up racist views. You're just a horrible human being and you need to be ashamed of yourself, because you're $%^&ing retarded, and you're too much of a *!@#ing coward to stand up and admit it.
You $%^&ing piece of $%^& retarded coward.
There is no measurement for the blood spilled and sacrifices made by good men and women so you can stand there and %^&* on their memory, wrapping yourself in a document you don't deserve the God-damned benefits from.
AND YET...
I still defend TO THE DEATH your right to act like a @#$%ing moron.
But I would not piss on you to put you out when the consequences of your actions light you on fire. I will point and laugh and watch you burn.
Heh, the Pastor should read this too... and realize, as said in the thread, yelling 'FIRE' is not protected.
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