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Feral Druid Cataclysm (85) Tanking Guide
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Post by
Shadax
So, let's see. Based on the bear stat weights I found in the topic at the top of these forums (From EJ for patch 4.0.3), Agility is worth 22.41, Dodge is worth 19.55, Crit is worth 6.35, Hit is worth 2.13.
Heroic Essence has 363 Agility (8134.83) and a proc of 2178 crit (13830.3). The page for Essence says the ICD is 50 sec, and the proc rate is 10%, giving it a roughly effective 1 PPM. This means it's up essentially 1/6th the time, so that 2178 becomes an effective 363 (2305.05). This gives Essence a value of about 10439.88, give or take a smidge based on procs.
Fluid Death has 321 Hit (683.73) and a stacking 38 Agility to 380 Agility (8515.8). After reforging to dodge, F.D. has 193 Hit (411.09) and 128 Dodge (2502.4). We'll even say that the Agility is only 95% of that 380, due to the stacking mechanic, bringing us to 361 Agility (8090.01). This gives Fluid Death a value of about 11003.5, give or take a smidge depending on fight duration/phase transitions.
If those stat weights are reasonably valid, Fluid Death is superior as long as you can maintain the full agility stack up >~90% of the time.
Edited to correct to Heroic Essence instead of Regular.
Post by
Cambo
+1 for Alamo reference.
Post by
144872
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
657884
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Shadax
Ack, so we are. I'll edit the first post to be correct.
Post by
Thror
Hm. I will use the trinket list on AskMrRobot. It is arranged by stat weighs, and is definitely a better reference than what i used to arrange the trinkets. If you are curious,
this is what the top ranks look like
. Thanks for your feedback guys.
Post by
LookOut
The longer the fight, the closer they are, but shorter fights the immediate agil from H Essence will surpass FD.
Thing is, we're talking about raiding here. There are no supershort fights where FD barely gets any chance to stack up.
And if you think stacks can drop off, let's check out the current tier bosses:
Magmaw: There's always something to hit
Omnotron: You can't hit the tron when he puts his shield up, so it might drop there. However, iirc the shield only lasts 10 sec, while FD stacks last 15 sec
Atramedes: It drops every time he's in the air.
Chimaeron: you are able to still hit chimi during Feud
Maloriak: you can melee the boss while waiting for adds to spawn.
Nefarian: You can keep up the stacks, unless you are the add tank, in which case they drop but they also stack up FAST (as in: after 1 or 2 aoe moves)
Halfus: There's always something to hit
V&T: the only time you might have your stacks drop off is on heroic when you're phased into the twilight realm and you don't have a portal close to you.
Council: There's always something to hit
Cho'gall: There's always something to hit
SInestra: there's probably always something to hit. Dunno, haven't unlocked her yet :p
And while crit is quite nice for us, a static amount of dodge still seems better to me.
Post by
657884
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Thror
If you look at the top though, it says BiS is Essence and FD. Again, the differences are so minor it's really not worth the debate, especially if you already have both. Pre H Essence, it's FD and Tia's.
Well, that's not much of a surprise. Fluid + Tia agility buffs do not stack, so with Tia out of the equation you pick the third trinket off the top, which is the Essence of the Cyclone heroic. The second best agility trinket after that is the Left Eye of Rajh, which beats the Essence of the Cyclone normal. I'll get to editting when I come home, I had plenty of work to do at work today, and I am letting the Warrior tank Sinestra :3
Post by
curlymon
Fluid + Tia agility buffs do not stack,
Yes they do. I can confirm this.
Post by
Thror
That's weird. I'd have to see that.
Also, trinkets re-ordered for better accuracy.
Post by
curlymon
That's weird. I'd have to see that.
Also, trinkets re-ordered for better accuracy.
Our bear MT has used these two for a while now and I can confirm the agi boosts stacking. I will try and get a screenie from him for you.
Post by
LookOut
That's weird. I'd have to see that.
Also, trinkets re-ordered for better accuracy.
Our bear MT has used these two for a while now and I can confirm the agi boosts stacking. I will try and get a screenie from him for you.
If your MT stacks agi, using double agi trinkets is not really healthy. I did it when starting out on hard modes, and I died a lot until another tank told me to swap out one of em for a stam trinket.
Post by
657884
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
curlymon
That's weird. I'd have to see that.
Also, trinkets re-ordered for better accuracy.
Our bear MT has used these two for a while now and I can confirm the agi boosts stacking. I will try and get a screenie from him for you.
If your MT stacks agi, using double agi trinkets is not really healthy. I did it when starting out on hard modes, and I died a lot until another tank told me to swap out one of em for a stam trinket.
Our MT has a set of Stam trinkets he swaps in for applicable fights, lol, never said he did not. Just that he has used and still does use FD and Tia's.
As for Hard modes He has the needed basic HP to push the early ones without a significant change to gearing ideas that a simple change in trinkets and flask cannot fix, as stated in the very guide we post on.
Post by
Thror
Sorry for not believing you outright, curly. I just checked it and they really stack. Don't know why, but i had this strong feeling that they just can not stack because they are pretty much the same buff. Interesting thing to know, i already started using them in tandem.
Post by
curlymon
Sorry for not believing you outright, curly.
No issue in the slightest, testing and confirmation is always needed and anything that helps the community is a good thing!
Can't really argue with 720 "free" Agi :P
Post by
335958
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Post by
Heckler
For some reason, they don't want anything other than a general FAQ, helpful threads, and an off-topic thread (and for some reason, a stat-weightings thread) stickied in each class forum. So it's been "stickied" by being listed in the helpful threads.
Most of the other class forums already violate this template though (we have the fewest stickies of all the Class forums)... with threads that are not
nearly
of this level of quality, I might add. Gnub said he would "think about it" but i don't think he's said anything since. Personally, I think the thread deserves to be 'properly' stickied simply because of its amazing level of quality... this is definitely something to be proud of, not only for Thror, but for the Wowhead.com community in general who Thror wrote it for.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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