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Can of Worms: Does telling a racist joke make you racist?
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Post by
Liquoid
Western society is inherently racist (and sexist and homophobic), what with straight white males considered the 'default'.
Stolen from another thread:
I'm not white, but I've seen every Wes Andersen movie and I just went to Coachella so I basically have a PhD in white people right now.
Basically, being white is like this: think of the most socially awkward situation you've ever been in, and make it last your entire life. That's being white. Everything is awkward for them. White people try so hard to not be awkward that they end up being awkward as all hell and honestly it's soooo cute. It's like watching a dog with socks on.
White people have a hard time being comfortable in the skin they're in. If a white person is proud of being white, they are labelled a racist. White people have to carry the burdens of all the &*!@#$y things their grandparents did to everyone else. This makes white people very sensitive to social situations because they are obsessed with not perpetuating negative stereotypes. Unfortunately this overt self awareness hinders them from doing activites that require an accute lack of $%^&s given (such as) dancing, playing sports, being cool, etc.
But even with all of this, I think that all of us have a little white in us. Sometimes there's days where you just wanna hop in your Honda civic, turn on some Smashing Pumpkins, and drive the speed limit. Sometimes I wanna go to Starbucks and overpay for bad coffee. Sometimes I wanna pretend I know what's going on during a David Lynch movie. Sometimes I wanna non ironically listen to Garth Brooks. Birkenstocks are comfortable as !@#$. NPR is the only news source you can really trust these days.
Just read perks of being a wallflower. It's like the white people manifesto. Lays everything out for you.
Post by
ElhonnaDS
Snip
I am a white person, and I approve this joke- lol
Post by
MyTie
I typed up the black version of that "joke". Then I realized I didn't want to be banned, so I stopped.
I don't think it's funny. I think it's stupid, and inaccurate.
Post by
952951
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Post by
Azazel
i see what you did there :D
Win.
Also, I think pregnant women shouldn't be allowed to smoke. They should be allowed to before and after pregnancy, but not during.
Post by
168916
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Post by
Squishalot
I find it odd that so many people answered "No" to this. Telling a racist joke is pretty obviously a racist act - what else would it be?
So does somebody who does something a little bit racist every now and then necessarily count as "racist" full stop? Possibly not, but it must do to some extent, mustn't it?
I have to admit, I was surprised for the same reason that you are. Without singling Thror out on purpose, but his comment was on the front page and it summed things up pretty well:
I don't think so. By the same logic, telling sexist jokes would make one a sexist. I love sexist jokes and I am not a sexist.
It's the idea that "I think they're okay, and I don't want to think of myself as a racist, so therefore racist jokes musn't be racist". There's a logical fallacy there.
Post by
952951
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Post by
168916
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Post by
164232
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Post by
MyTie
I think the problem with this question is the very last word. It doesn't really have any quantification. Does it make you
racist
? If you know the difference between the races, and you see someone who is of a different race and acknowledge that difference in your mind, you are to at least some minute degree, racist. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a non comatose person who is not racist. I think what is "understood" here is that the degree to which is being described her is a racist who is so racist as to be such to a negative and unacceptable degree. But, even that is hard to agree on.
So, I'd have to say that yes, doing X based on race makes you racist, whether that be tell a joke, start a fight, sit next to someone at a table, give someone a job, deny someone a job, smile, etc.
Post by
Squishalot
The was recently a TV show on the ABC in Australia (can't for the life of me remember the name at the moment) which had a studio audience, and put them all through a series of indivisual tests about race etc.
Do you remember when it was on? Sounds interesting.
If you know the difference between the races, and you see someone who is of a different race and acknowledge that difference in your mind, you are to at least some minute degree, racist. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a non comatose person who is not racist.
So aren't we stereotyping when we do that? ;)(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Squishalot##DELIM##
Post by
MyTie
If you know the difference between the races, and you see someone who is of a different race and acknowledge that difference in your mind, you are to at least some minute degree, racist. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a non comatose person who is not racist.
So aren't we stereotyping when we do that? ;)
How do you figure?
Post by
Squishalot
So aren't we stereotyping when we do that? ;)
How do you figure?
We're making an assumption about what a person is based on the race that they are. That's what a racial stereotype is, when you boil it down.
Post by
MyTie
We're making an assumption about what a person is based on the race that they are. That's what a racial stereotype is, when you boil it down.
I thought you were referring to the part of my post about the simple recognition of the race of an individual. I don't think it is stereotypical to say that a black person is black, but I think it might be racist, in some small fashion. This might be too much of a stretch, though. At one point, it might have been accurate, but in today's understanding, racism is almost always aligned with negativity.
Post by
Squishalot
I thought you were referring to the part of my post about the simple recognition of the race of an individual. I don't think it is stereotypical to say that a black person is black, but I think it might be racist, in some small fashion. This might be too much of a stretch, though. At one point, it might have been accurate, but in today's understanding, racism is almost always aligned with negativity.
No, I don't think that's stereotypical either. I agree with what you're saying, generally speaking. The issue I take with a lot of the comments in this thread is that it seems to be that as long as we're being positive (i.e. humourous), even if we're pointing out a neutral/negative racial characteristic, then we're not racist in a colloquial sense. I'm not sure that's right.
Post by
MyTie
I think it comes from social approval. It seems to me that the train of thought is: "Most people think it's funny, so it must be ok". I don't think people put a lot of analysis into their actions on their own, or, more accurately, as much as I think they should. I think people do whatever other people like, generally speaking. For instance, if there were a big push in society against racist jokes, and movie stars started speaking out against it, and news outlets focused put out fluff pieces about the pain racist jokes cause, and everyone's favorite rock star politician spoke out against it, and comedians stopped doing it, then there would (I feel) be more collective moral outrage on this board.
Edit: Disclaimer: I don't think everyone on this entire board conforms to these standards at all times, nor do I have supporting empirical evidence. This comes from personal experience and opinion.
Edit: Edit: Disclaimer: The previous disclaimer can be applied to most of my posts.
Post by
164232
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
Yeah, I remember - we raised this on
page 3 of this thread
, lol.
I think part of the issue is that they tie the two together. The phrase 'White C...' doesn't really get used. The implication is that all black people are C's, and that's why it blew up into a race thing. It's hard to untangle the two, IMO.
Post by
164232
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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