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DD (Daily Debate) 60 - Batman vs Iron man
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Post by
Skreeran
If the kid (or adult) already had problems BEFORE playing the game, then its true the game could make them worst, but the game itself was not the catalyst of the problem. It NEVER is.I agree with this statement. Unnatural violent thoughts (i.e. outside the normal range; at some point or another everyone has violent thoughts) tend to come from poor development as a child, often because of abuse or traits they picked up from their parents, not because they played violent video games.
That being said, I think it's the parents responsibility to choose what games are appropriate for their children to play. There is an ESRB for a reason. Don't blame the game industry because you bought n M rated game for your 8 year old and it turned out to be violent.
Post by
Skreeran
If the kid (or adult) already had problems BEFORE playing the game, then its true the game could make them worst, but the game itself was not the catalyst of the problem. It NEVER is.I agree with this statement. Unnatural violent thoughts (i.e. outside the normal range; at some point or another everyone has violent thoughts) tend to come from poor development as a child, often because of abuse or traits they picked up from their parents, not because they played violent video games.
That being said, I think it's the parents responsibility to choose what games are appropriate for their children to play. There is an ESRB for a reason. Don't blame the game industry because you bought n M rated game for your 8 year old and it turned out to be violent.
Post by
557473
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
gnomerdon
1. kindness and compassion led them to this mess =(
2. they should have rights, but as a minority to the palestinian majority
3. power, guns, and false assumptions
Post by
ElhonnaDS
I think the initial plan was flawed- it hinged on the right of the UK to give away land in a colony. I think colonialism amounts to the slavery of one nation to another, and it wasn't right. The UK had something they'd taken and held by force from the indigenous people, and gave it to someone else who was much less physically capable of defending it from the original inhabitants. This created a situation where, in order to keep Israel viable, the US and UK had to intervene militarily when they were threatened. Unfortunately, this in turn created a situation where, with the confidence of the US backing them regardless of what they do, Israel has repeatedly taken more and more land from surrounding areas, and broken every treaty to do so.
This isn't to say that I think that the acts of terrorism are justified- acts of terror and making war on the civilian population is NEVER justified. But I think a large portion of the conflict in the Middle East was the creation of a state that can't exist without ongoing conflict. Israel can't return the land to the original inhabitants without ceasing to exist, so that's not an option for them. The surrounding countries feel they have the moral right to insist that everything taken be returned, so they won't accept anything less than that even if that goal is unobtainable. So they remain at war constantly.
I think that at this point, both sides have done so much wrong that no one is really "in the right" anymore. And I don't see a resolution any time in the near future.
Post by
557473
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ElhonnaDS
I think that at this point, both sides have done so much wrong that no one is really "in the right" anymore.
Agreed. But, I did not put 'now' for discussion. It is more of "back then" discussion. Why this land belongs to Jews/Israelis if they simply spread around the world instead of fighting for it against all the invaders (Romans, Crusaders Ottomans what else was there)? They did not seem to care about it much until they were given the land and now all of sudden it is their land? BS!
If you've studied any of the history, you'll know that Israel (then Judea) was actually dismantled by the Roman Empire, and many of the Jewish inhabitants were killed, sold into slavery or forcibly removed from the area, as a result of losing wars against the Roman Empire.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_the_Roman_Empire
Which is why they feel like they're entitled to the land- their ancestors were subjected to the same treatment, and worse, the Palestinians got, like 1800-2300 years ago, by the Romans. But if you go further back, the Old Testament says that they took the land from Amalekites, and were ordered by got to kill every man, woman and child, and even the livestock.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amalek
So, the question is does a 2000 year old claim have more validity than a 70 year old claim, and how far back do you have to go before you find someone who didn't take it by force?
Post by
Skreeran
Canus de Wormus Overtado:
DD 59 - Is the whole concept of Israel in initially flawed and/or was badly executed? (Note: Basically 3 questions to discuss
Why Palestinians pay for crimes of Germans?
What right do Jews/Israelis have for the land?
What right do people who gave land to them have in order to pull this off?
I can't help but feel you are leading the question...
As for what right? Ask either side, and they'll tell you that God gave them the right to the land, and it would be morally and spiritually wrong to give it to their enemy.
It doesn't matter who had it first, because in the end it all comes back to religion.
Post by
ElhonnaDS
I took a couple of world religions classes in College with a professor (who was Jewish) who said that the Old Testament account was that prophets warned the Jewish people what the land would be taken from them as a punishment for disobeying God, and that the diaspora was his will. He said that technically, since God never rescinded the punishment, the return to Israel is actually in defiance of what God told them in the Old Testament, as opposed to being supported by it. He said that people were quoting it selectively, and not looking at the whole timeline. I don't have a source to quote, though- just him.
EDIT: Also, change the title. People think we're still talking about video games.
Post by
557473
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
gamerunknown
I believe in the right of the Israeli people to self-determination. I don't think that's a very controversial position. What may be more controversial is the borders under which Israel operates, to which I yield to...
well, you've probably guessed already
.
Post by
ElhonnaDS
I believe the question "Why the sudden interest," is kind of ridiculous. The "sudden interest" was a result of over 6 million Jewish people who were killed specifically for being Jewish in Europe, and another 3.5 million who survived the concentration camps but were very nearly killed, and were most definitely tortured and traumatized.
When the diaspora occurred, many Jewish people became citizens of other countries. There have been greater or lesser degrees of anti-semetic sentiment in many of those countries over the years, but they were generally afforded the same protections as other citizens. WW2 was evidence that this wasn't necessarily always going to be the case, and a great many people who had felt comfortable as a Jewish citizen in a non-Jewish state suddenly had good reason to fear that their lives could be in danger based on the whim of the majority at any time. They felt they could no longer trust a non-Jewish government to protect them. Which is a fair sentiment, given what happened. The question is whether or not it was a good idea, or a fair one, to carve their autonomous state out of Palestine and not, say, Germany.
But really- "Why the sudden interest in the 1950's?" Are you even thinking about what you're asking?
Post by
Skreeran
I took a couple of world religions classes in College with a professor (who was Jewish) who said that the Old Testament account was that prophets warned the Jewish people what the land would be taken from them as a punishment for disobeying God, and that the diaspora was his will. He said that technically, since God never rescinded the punishment, the return to Israel is actually in defiance of what God told them in the Old Testament, as opposed to being supported by it. He said that people were quoting it selectively, and not looking at the whole timeline. I don't have a source to quote, though- just him.
EDIT: Also, change the title. People think we're still talking about video games.That's the thing about religion, though, it doesn't matter what's "correct," as long as a large number of people believe. Ask any Israeli Jew who has the God-given right to the land, and he will tell you the Jews.
I don't believe in gods, so I don't think that religion should have anything to do with it, but it does. As long as both groups believe God wants them to own the land, the problem will continue.
Post by
331902
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
557473
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ElhonnaDS
Well...the "why" of it being that particular strip of land is religious. It's considered holy to them, as it was the land which God once gave them according to the Old Testament.
Post by
gnomerdon
russia seems to have a lot of extra land.
why not move the jews there?
it's surprising to see how small germany is compared to the vastness of russia.
when i learnt about germany vs russia as a kid, i thought both super powers were the almost the same country size.
Post by
331902
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
557473
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
gnomerdon
According to the 1939 population census, 17,695 Jews lived in the region (16% of the total population). The Jewish population peaked in 1948 at around 30,000, about one-quarter of the region's population. The census of 1959, taken six years after Stalin's death, revealed that the Jewish population of the JAO declined to 14,269 persons. As of 2002, 2,327 Jews were living in the JAO (1.2% of the total population), while ethnic Russians made up 90% of the JAO population.
russia must have been too cold to live there :l yes. it's inhabitable.
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