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Good Tanking Rotation?
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Post by
Sakkura
Nope, you just simply do not add anything to Shield Slam. In other words, if one has enough rage for both abilities, then use Heroic Strike in addition to Shield Slam. It's a bonus, not a replacement, =D
Losing the bonus just puts you back at ground zero, it doesn't shove you into the negative.
I still don't get it. The bonus is still a rage dump since you only use it to dump any excess rage that can't be used on GCD abilities.
Post by
147387
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Post by
Simulator
I still don't get it. The bonus is still a rage dump since you only use it to dump any excess rage that can't be used on GCD abilities.
By your definition you are saying every skill is a rage dump then. :)
I completely agree with Arideni. I as well use heroic strike very actively and do not consider it a rage dump. As long as you are doing raid content that is around your item level there shouldn't be any problems to mash your active skills while heroic striking.
When I play on alts and group with warriors who don't use their heroic strike ability agressively the difference in TPS is noticeable.
HS is what I use when everything else is on CD and I already have 5 devs up. Most boss fights have me sitting near 100 rage all the time anyway, but if rage is an issue, you only hit HS if you have enough rage to use your other abilities before/after it.
You should be using heroic strike even while you are mashing your other abilities... presuming you are talking about tanking a raid encounter.
Post by
Sakkura
By your definition you are saying every skill is a rage dump then. :)
I completely agree with Arideni. I as well use heroic strike very actively and do not consider it a rage dump. As long as you are doing raid content that is around your item level there shouldn't be any problems to mash your active skills while heroic striking.
When I play on alts and group with warriors who don't use their heroic strike ability agressively the difference in TPS is noticeable.
No. Every other threat-generating ability is on the GCD, and most of them generate more threat per rage than HS (all the important ones do). That's why HS becomes the fire into which you toss all the rage you can't use on the GCD abilities, and turn it into some extra threat.
Yes, you have to do so proactively when you expect a high rage income. No, you should not do so proactively always. Mindlessly spamming HS is just as damaging to your TPS as never using it at all, since it means you won't always be able to afford a shield slam or whatever.
Post by
95950
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Post by
Arideni
I have to disagree. Heroic Strike is no longer a rage dump as it was pre-The Burning Crusade. It should be used regularly as an active throttle instead of an intermittent dump.
I knew I said "throttle" somewhere!
Post by
pluto9302
I have to disagree. Heroic Strike is no longer a rage dump as it was pre-The Burning Crusade. It should be used regularly as an active throttle instead of an intermittent dump.
your prolly right, i never use it though. Heroic strike sits in my ability book and i dont think i use it unless i go PvP arms spec. But i never get things pulled off of me so im not to worried about it.
that's all good if you don't get pulled off of, however, if you're in a 25man tanking a boss you would want to be generating as much threat as possible and thus should NEVER have 100rage, if you have 100 rage you're not generating as much threat as you can, more threat = more dps = no threat cap for classes which cannot aggro dump
Post by
122584
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Post by
Sakkura
I'm almost crying when i see how useless it is to explain the correctly use of the HS quing rule. Dont you really get it? Queuing is how to describe the time between skills on the Global cool-down. When you hit devestate for example you have to wait a small time before you can hit it again. Heroic strike (and cleave) don’t apply to this rule, so you can hit devestate, then hit heroic strike. This will activate the next melee swing skill. You can still hit devestate in the meantime if it comes up before you next melee swing, and heroic strike/cleave will remained “queued” until your next melee swing. Constantly queuing skills like this allows you to generate threat extremely quickly. If you still dont get it, then reroll your class, cause you are useless as a tank...
You don't seem to understand that this will sometimes leave you without rage for using eg. shield slam, which will significantly nerf your TPS, making you a poor tank.
Mindless HS-spamming is not always a good idea.
Post by
166352
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Post by
53090
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Post by
Sakkura
I'm assuming you've never played Magic or any other game like that with different timings.
Think about it this way
if you make a macro:
/cast Shield Slam
/cast Heroic Strike
if you don't have enough rage for both, your character will cast Shield Slam and won't cast Heroic Strike. If you do have enough Rage for both, then your character will cast both. Shield Slam will always go off when you use the macro, it's heroic strike that may or may not cast.
... If I use heroic strike and shield slam now, then after the GCD from the shield slam is over, my heroic strike is likely to have finished too (assuming I had the rage for it). Then I want to use another GCD ability - this could very well be devastate. But it can happen that I used almost all my rage on those two abilities, and haven't received any more rage since. Then I can't use the devastate ability; instead I have to wait for rage. This nerfs my TPS.
Get it now?
Post by
Porcell
if you make a macro:
/cast Shield Slam
/cast Heroic Strike
if you don't have enough rage for both, your character will cast Shield Slam and won't cast Heroic Strike. If you do have enough Rage for both, then your character will cast both. Shield Slam will always go off when you use the macro, it's heroic strike that may or may not cast.
What if you have 10 rage? 12 Rage? You hit that macro, your Shield Slam isn't going to go off, and you just queued a HS for your next white attack. Congrats, you just failed at tanking by using a HS when your SS CD was up and burning up your rage. See the point?
Post by
Aedalas
I've ran into this problem before, what I did is set up my bars so that I have the macro'd combo's in one spot and all the normal attacks in another spot for use in a low rage situation. This also helps to moniter cooldowns.
Post by
122584
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Post by
Sakkura
You don't seem to understand that this will sometimes leave you without rage for using eg. shield slam, which will significantly nerf your TPS, making you a poor tank.
Mindless HS-spamming is not always a good idea.
And you dont seem to understand a *!@# of what i wrote..
Actually, it seems to be you who doesn't understand what I (and porcell) am pointing out; namely that your method will reduce TPS by spending rage on heroic strike instead of GCD abilities when the supply of rage is limited.
Post by
95950
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Post by
kevinjohn3d
You are both right. If you think about Yakra's choice of words: "throttle".
When you're low on gas in your car, you don't floor it, you conserve gas.
When you have plenty of gas, you can worry less about it and step on it a bit.
When you're low on rage, you want to conserve your rage. Save it for a devestate or shield slam.
When you're mid to high on rage, it's better to get HS in there to generate the extra threat.
Whatever you want to call it, rage dump or whatever. You still will want to use it to generate threat.
Post by
122584
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Post by
122584
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