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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
This is why we cannot have nice things...
-_-
Post by
484763
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Post by
Squishalot
And can i say that though god created everyone , to destroy them there must be a reason otherwise he would be evil and not god as we know him.
You can't, because that would be based on a presumption that God is 'good', not 'evil'.
What if his reason was to screw you around? As we do with our Sims?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
You can't, because that would be based on a presumption that God is 'good', not 'evil'.
It's not a presumption. He's that by which we define 'good.'
Post by
HiVolt
You can't, because that would be based on a presumption that God is 'good', not 'evil'.
It's not a presumption. He's that by which we define 'good.'
I'm not trying to offend anyone by saying this, but I have a question about this answer.
What is it exactly that defines "good" or "evil"?
This is a question of morality, and morality is brought about through social acceptance or non-acceptance of an idea.
If God is "good", then all of society must accept that he is. If all of society does not, then is he truly "good", or is he "good" in a purely subjective sense?
Post by
484763
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I'm not trying to offend anyone by saying this, but I have a question about this answer.
What is it exactly that defines "good" or "evil"?
This is a question of morality, and morality is brought about through social acceptance or non-acceptance of an idea.
If God is "good", then all of society must accept that he is. If all of society does not, then is he truly "good", or is he "good" in a purely subjective sense?
Anything that is measured in degrees must be based of some standard. We only say something is good insofar as it confirms to the standard of goodness. Now since God is perfect he must have the fullness of goodness, which would make him the standard. So what we call good is something that conforms in some degree to the perfect goodness in God.
Post by
Squishalot
You can't, because that would be based on a presumption that God is 'good', not 'evil'.
It's not a presumption. He's that by which we define 'good.'
A definition, by definition, is also a presumption.
Well, assumption, anyway. So I rephrase:
"You can't, because that would be based on an assumption that God is 'good', not 'evil', and you have no fundamental basis for believing that his definition of 'good' is what you understand it to be."
Post by
350146
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Post by
Tukar
using your logic, that means our parents can kill us as and when they want, because they made us and we didn't listen to them?
and if it really have no fault, does it mean that slavery and stoning people to death is right?
it probably have no fault during the era it was written as well as at hundreds of years ago but i doubt its the same in modern context.
I just want you guys to know that every thing I say is based on my knowledge of the subject, what I've read, researched, etc etc, but I don't claim this all to be 100% true, so if you disagree with me it's completely fine. We can keep volleying off arguments back and forth for days, but I am convinced that in the end, any body who does believe in God will not be persuaded other wise and vise versa. But I will offer my input on this.
If you raise kids, and they completely disobey or hate you, what can you do? Keep trying? Eventually give them up to some body else? Just deal with it? I don't recall any passages okaying the death of disobedient children (thought I could be wrong), but I do know one of the key commandments is to love and obey your parents, and you are guaranteed blessings if you do so.
Slavery in a modern context is wrong, but in a time without machinery, electricity, etc etc there had to be building power of some sort. In the context of that time period, slavery was a must have to any flourishing civilization, and while the Bible did not forbid it, it wasn't really encouraging people to have slaves or embrace this particular hierarchy. All law and commandments regarding slaves were a "treat your slave as such" and "treat your master as such" as if the condition were pre-existing. In the end Christians are taught to be slaves to God, and in Scripture the illustration of slave and master in a social context is some times used to further elaborate how relationship between God and man /should/ be.
But you're correct. In today's politically correct nation, these things are totally taboo. If you spank your child they'll probably be taken away from you.
Oh and laginging, send me a message if you can! I don't want to start discussing against other religions in a public context, I don't think any body else wants to hear me rant on about what I believe to be contradictions in the Quran and self defeating philosophies of the Buddhist belief system : P
Post by
349103
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Post by
350146
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Post by
350146
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Post by
HiVolt
that a good question for another thread but right now good is what is generally felt good by most people the point being to communicate but please leave other philosophical debates out of thisReligion includes all aspects of philosophy, including morality, making my question very relevant to the topic. I agree that another thread based solely on morality might be a better place to discuss the intricacies of that subject, but I was referring to the notion of Good and Evil (morality) in respect to God.
Anything that is measured in degrees must be based of some standard. We only say something is good insofar as it confirms to the standard of goodness. Now since God is perfect he must have the fullness of goodness, which would make him the standard. So what we call good is something that conforms in some degree to the perfect goodness in God.
Okay, still wrapping my head around this one. What I'm getting out of your answer is that God is perfect, so he must ultimately be perfectly good. This is why we would compare all other things to God in the sense of it's value of goodness.
What I'm wondering, is how can we attribute perfect goodness to God, and make him the standard, without there already being a standard in place to compare him against? Or is it that there was no standard of perfect goodness before God, and if so, how can we know what perfect goodness would be?
Post by
204878
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Post by
484763
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484763
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Post by
386234
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Post by
Orranis
DT 6:5, MT 22:37, MK 12:30, LK 10:27 Love God.
DT 6:13, PS 33:8, 34:9, 111:10, 115:13, 128:1, 147:11, PR 8:13, 16:6, 19:23, 22:4, IS 8:13, LK 12:5, 1PE 2:17 Fear God.
1JN 4:18 There is no fear in love.
PR 30:5 Every word of God proves true.
1KI 22:23, 2CH 18:22, JE 4:10, JE 20:7, EZ 14:9 God deceives some of the prophets.
JE 8:8 The scribes (copyists, editors, teachers) falsify the word.
2TH 2:11-12 God deceives the wicked (to be able to condemn them).
(Note: Not every word of God can prove true if God deceives anyone at all; teaching from the Bible cannot be trusted if the scribes falsify the word. In other words, the first reference is mutually exclusive with the other three. Thus, the Bible cannot be the perfect work of a perfect, all-powerful and loving God since one or more of the above references is obviously untrue. Note also: Some versions use the word "persuade" rather than "deceives." The context makes clear, however, that deception is involved.)
EZ 20:25 God says that he intentionally gave out bad laws. (This means that God-given laws or commandments are sometimes suspect.)
LK 1:26-38 The angel who appears to Mary to foretell the birth of Jesus says that Jesus will be given the throne of David, that he will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and that his kingdom will never end. (None of this took place nor can it now be fulfilled.)
MT 16:28, MK 9:1, LK 9:27 Jesus says that some of his listeners will not taste death before he comes again in his kingdom. This was said almost 2000 years ago.
(Note: This passage and many others indicate that Jesus was to come again in a relatively short period of time and not just "quickly" as present day Biblicists assert. All of his listeners are now dead, yet Jesus has not come again in his kingdom. All of the alleged words of Jesus put forth in the Bible are therefore suspect.)
MK 16:17-18 A believer can handle snakes or drink poison and not experience any harm.
(Note: Many unfortunate believers have died as a result of handling snakes and drinking poison. This kind of assertion negates the Bible as a useful guidebook for life.)
A googled list
Pi doesn't equal three
The earth is not a circle, it is a three dimensional obloidal sphere. Nor does it have four corners.
The sun should be created before the plants as plants need sunlight to photosynthesise.
The sky is not a solid structure.
The sun does not move around the earth.
Insects do not have four legs.
The Israelite population went from 75 to several million in a few hundred years.
A brass serpent and a pole will not cure a snakebite
Giants do not exist.
Unicorns do not exist.
The earth is not suspended in space by pillars.
The moon does not produce it's own light.
According to scripture, congenitally disabled children are made by god that way, not due to unfortunate genetic mutation.
Dead seeds do not germinate.
The deaf and mute are not possessed by the devil.
This. Though now I can sense someone is going to pull up and go "But who made those genetic mutations, huh?" completely ignoring the rest.
Post by
204878
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