Comments

Comment by 4130

Remember folks: you can PUG Kazzak. He's not that hard. However, if you PUG him you might lose this to a paladin.

Is it better to PUG Kazzak than never to have killed Kazzak at all? That's the real question...

Comment by Thottbot

(coming from an SS rogue, presenting an argument as to how it would benefit an SS rogue)

(Note: As I will show you, this weapon is best used by an SS rogue. Though it will be beneficial in the hands of a warrior, pally, shaman, or hunter, the nature of the proc makes it best fit for a duel-wielding class such as a rogue. In a shield-using class, the value of the proc in a weapon such as Teebu is better than in this weapon.)

indeed, this weapon would be superior to all others. with an average damage of 134.40 (just 2.44 damage under the avg 136.88 damage of Teebu) this mace would indeed deal out massive damage. Though it is less damaging than the Teebu, the proc is much more useful for a duel-wielding class.

Comment by Thottbot

Here is why this proc is superior:

Let us consider that the weapons proc at the same rate (procs/time) the proc on Teebu's will be a straight 150 damage per proc. As I said, the average damage of this weapon is 134.40 damage (48.0*2.80=134.40). When this weapon procs, the speed will become ~2.33 (2.80/1.20~~2.33) The DPS of the weapon during this 10second proc time will be 57.6 damage/second. The DPS difference over a non-proccing time will be 9.60 damage/second (57.6-48.0=9.60). Factored in over 10 seconds, the damage the proc puts out each time it procs will be 96.00 damage. Now, this is less than the 150 damage Teebu's puts out, but note that this is the damage output of just this weapon when it procs. The weapon proc description says that it increases your raw attack speed, which means that both weapons (mainhand and offhand) will be effected.

Comment by Thottbot

now, as shown, this weapon is inferior to similar end-game weapons for shield-using classes as less damage is done per proc than with similar endgame weapons. However, this is not the case for a dual-wielder such as an SS rogue. Consider for the sake of example that the rogue in question was using the Felstriker in their offhand. The stats for the Felstriker are as follows: 45.60 DPS, Speed 1.70, and 77.52 Average Damage (45.60*1.70=77.52). When this weapon procs, the speed of the Felstriker will become ~1.42 (1.70/1.20~~1.42). During this proc-time, the DPS of the Felstriker will become 54.72 damage/second (77.52/1.42=54.72). During this 10 second proc-time, the DPS increase over non-proc-time will be 9.12 damage/second. over the 10second proc-time, this will bring out an additional 91.20 damage from the Felstriker due to the proc on this weapon. Combined with the 96.00 damage from this weapon, the total damage the proc will add will be 187.20 damage compared to the 150 fire damage the Teebu proc deals.

Comment by Thottbot

Now, I know that some will say that the conclusion I will present is faulty, as this example is only a demonstration for the rogue using this weapon with the Felstriker, however I will also present the total damage added by the proc for additional weapons, albeit without all the calculations shown. This list can be seen below, in which I list the offhand weapon used followed by the total damage the proc would deal in this simulation.

Felstriker||187.20
Vis'kag the Bloodletter||187.40
Alcor's Sunrazor||168.43
Heartseeker||179.00
Dragon's Call||178.80
Krol Blade||177.80
Skullforge Reaver||178.80
Scarlet Kris||178.60
Darrowspike||178.60
Mirah's Song||176.00 (Mirah's Song is a freakin quest reward! So there is no excuse not to have at least this weapon)
Hurd Smasher||194.80 (a fist weapon, which also gives the biggest damage boost I've found in my calculations)
The Cruel Hand of Timmy||176.00
Cho'Rush's Blade||176.00
Fang of the Crystal Spider||176.60
Keris of Zul'Serak||174.80
Hanzo Sword||168.60
Thrash Blade||166.84 (Yes, even a weapon you can get as early as level 45 makes this proc better than that of Teebu)

Comment by Thottbot

Now, all of this data shows quite distinctly that this weapon is best used with a dual-wielder, such as a rogue. In the hands of a player that only uses 1 weapon, this and a shield, the damage gained in the proc would be a measly 96.00 damage. The Teebu's proc is 150.00 damage. This weapon is only good in the hands of a duel wielder. And because Sinister Strike adds an extra 50.60 DPS to this weapon (/4=50.60)(the speed in these calculations is 4.00seconds because with the SS talent that all SS rogues have, a sinister strike may be used once every 4 seconds)(note this is raw DPS, not factoring in attack power boost or crit boost, which vary from character to character. These added stats would only further boost the damage added by Sinister Strike), not to mention poisons, the added effect of slice and dice on this weapon's proc, Felstriker proccing during this weapon's proc, and the power of pinesol with lemon, this weapon is far more powerful in the hands of an SS rogue than any other class.

To conclude, this weapon is best used by an SS rogue. The are superior weapons for a Warrior or Pally. This weapon is not suitable for a Warrior or Pally.

Comment by Thottbot

Been a while since I've done this...
(this assumes a rogue would have 2 talents in Imp Sinister strike)

94-175 Damage gives the weapon a Damage range of 81 (40.5 both ways from avg)

Well give our user an attack power of 700 for arguement.

700/14 = 50 <---This is our DPS bonus
It's a straight DPS add on which is why slow weapons might not benefit most attacks on classes.

multiply the total DPS by the weap speed

(50 + 48 Dam/s) * 2.8s = 274.4 Dam OMG!

274.4 - 40.4=234 low end damage

274.4 + 40.4= 314.8 high end

234-315 Damage 2.8 time our new stats

now all classes get this so what makes it so great for rogues? Well it's not so great really. . . regular attacks will only happen every 2.8 secs, but rogues get Sinister strike which they can use 1 per sec(40 energy). They can do 3 in as many secs and still receive their normal attacks.

These numbers translate into Sinister strikes critting in the 800's. And they can do it 3 times in 3 secs.

Sure your class might do well but unless you have these 1 sec attacks then you could also do similiar with any high DPS weapon.

If you have a weapon that's twice as fast you might only get half the attack bonus, but you get it twice as often. Rogues don't on specials, it would just be 1/2.

Maven

Comment by Thottbot

I just got this when we killed kazzak this afternoon. I'm a warrior and up until this point I had been using Axe of the Deep Woods to tank, so this is MUCH better.

I did roll against 3 pallies and 2 warriors and no one had any issues with me rolling. (That's what happens when you part with mature players)

Dannydarko
60 Human Warrior - Daggerspine

Comment by Thottbot

Had this bad boy a while now aswell as the Doomhide gauntlets Kazzak also drops. Was strictly combat swords till I recently respecced Hemo and after doing the calculations saw this would do more dmg main hand than my Viskag. My guild pretty much has a monopoly on Kazzak, Azu and the green dragons on my server, but we have only ever seen 1 demolisher.

http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/6207/empdemolisher6jl.jpg

Comment by Allakhazam

Yes, the SS was with the Hammer.

The Hammer/Felstriker unfortunately have been retired for the Perditions/Core Hound.

Loved that Hammer though, was an outstanding weapon.

updated profile:
http://wow.allakhazam.com/profile.html?112623

Comment by Allakhazam

Had this weapon for a while now, proc rate is a someone said below, always going off .. procs quite alot (which I thought it wouldn't when I first got it since it's a very very nice proc).

Damage is crazy with it too, my current highest sinister strike with this monster is:

http://www.plap.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/wow/ss.png

Highest standard melee crit I've had with it is 899 =p

I'd go as far as saying this is the best (other than pvp honor system reward sword) ss weapon in the game currently (I'd use this anyday over a teebu's just because of the proc).

Edited, Sun Jul 10 07:33:43 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

In the new patch (1.8) all speed of one hand weapons 2.4 all 2handers 3.3 and daggers 1.7 on special moves this has GIMPED all rogues and warriors this game has just become trash 4 melee .They have NERFED rogues and warriors so bad that i will not even play this piece of trash game again unless they fix this situation. ALL MELEE sucks now. Its so sad to see such a great game do something so stupid like this to ruin it 4 all (melee), it was almost unbelievable when i saw what they had done.

I have this weapon it was the best sinister strike weapon on the game other than pvp reward weapons that is, and now has become a P.O.S. Even pvp reward weapons are trash now b/c they are 2 slow between sinister strike only thing good about them now is the high dps. Faster weapons are the best now b/c all weapons are locked on the same speed for the special moves SO GHEY.

THERE IS NO DEPTH TO THE GAME ANYMORE

So bottom line is we will never hit the high crits and dps like we once did this is such BS. Today was a sad day =*(

world of warcraft can kiss my _ _ _ guess its back to DAOC 4 me.

When i say no DEPTH i mean on weapon selection. All anyone is going to try 4 now is the fastest weapon they can get their hands on to only come up short of what we once did. B4 if u were another class u would want the fast weapon like a hunter now we will all be going for the fast weapons with the most dps and the slow ones have no use. The slow speed bonus is no more that means no DEPTH and we have been GIMPED. plz dont be a sheep stand up 4 something. We did not deserve a nerf of any sort we already were not the damage dealers (ROGUES) as we were suppose to be as defined in the book.

In conclusion BLIZZARD should have fixed the blue weapons that were causing the prob and left the system how it was.

Edited, Fri Nov 4 12:49:40 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

Double post :/

Edited, Sat Mar 26 12:35:10 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

yep, dropped on kazzak yesterday on warsong.

Comment by Allakhazam

had a shammy gotten it would flurry and the proc stack?

Comment by Allakhazam

Anyone know what armor this Bane profile above is wearing?

Comment by Allakhazam

Got this last night, and after further review, this thing is always going off with haste. The proc rate seems much better than normal dmg procs, it goes off more than lifestealing for me as well.

Was pretty funny getting weapon haste, troll beserking and hitting slice and dice, I looked like a madman.

Btw, the proc sounds like sprint.

Blackrhino
Dragonblight

Edited, Fri Jun 10 08:54:25 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

We've gotten 3 of these maces last week alone. IMO, its common drop and Kazzak is sooooo easy to kill. Really good weapon but nothing insane IMO.

Comment by Allakhazam

w00t SS spam rulzz

Comment by Allakhazam

Pics:

http://members.cox.net/klaedsbane/hammer.jpg
http://members.cox.net/klaedsbane/empyrean.jpg

Comment by Allakhazam

definately rogue wep/ second a shaman

Comment by Allakhazam

Got it from Mr. Kazzak. Highest Sinister Strike so far is an even 900 on a sundered lava annihilator in Molten Core.

Comment by Allakhazam

Amazing mace. --Rogue Standpoint--

To answer all the general questions.

It usually procs once a battle. Longer battles two if not more times. It's a reliable chance on hit proc. You'll see it.

It is huge. Look at the pictures, it looks like a Mario Bros. Hammer or something. :P

Hemo, is amazing with it. Even putting points into what think is useless.. Ghostly Strike, you turn into an unbeatable opponent for other rogues. Around if not over 90% chance to dodge (evasion, and 25% base dodge chance), plus... the high white crits from the mace itself. Hemo makes this mace too powerful imo. lol

It does stack with Blade Flurry and SnD. Can you say 70% increased attk speed?

In normal battle, against any mob, I've crit white for over 700. It is even seen in MC with Molten Giants. It hits hard.

SS crits have been over 1k, Hemo crits have been over 800 easily (plate). Ghostly Strike crits (yes I have used GS in my build) over 900.

Lastly, not many guilds have a chance at Kazzak... so if you do get this, you'll be one of few who do have it.

~Ganta

Comment by Allakhazam

Drops off Lord Kazzak to stem the inevitable questions. Killed him yesterday, he's a damn good fight.

But two rogue drops for one rogue in the raid group. *sigh*

Edited, Sat Mar 26 15:25:41 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

this is masterly if Felstriker would proc at the same time

Comment by Allakhazam

Altera Vita ftw! /mourn Xev.

I believe that Bane was talking about his highest SS crit with the HAMMER was 1002, not his perditions.

Comment by Allakhazam

this is definately a Rogue weapon..serriously

Comment by Allakhazam

What is the optimal offhand for this mace? i'm combat mace speced currently using glacial.

reason i'm using glacial is i used to be dagger speced with lobo (crusader) and glacial (agil), so i figure the 25 agil is best on the offhand compared to the lobo.

my guild can clear mc and ony and starting bwl. so nothing in aq40 or later boss in aq20 and bwl is obtainable.

Comment by Allakhazam

back in the day of good WoW i solo'd Lord K with my pally and guess wut drops ^^ reckoning bomb BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!

Comment by Allakhazam

too bad weapon damage has absolutely no effect on eviscerate damage, dagger or sword evis damage will be the same... idiot

Comment by Allakhazam

http://wow.allakhazam.com/profile.html?112623

That is my profile.

Highest Sinster Strike so far, 1002 on Ragnaros :)

Comment by Allakhazam

Well considering the upgrade in the fury spec tree this would be IDEAL for them. I would cream my pants to have this as my MH. :o

Comment by Allakhazam

Ungh, can't decide between two felstikers or this and felstriker . . .

Comment by Allakhazam

The proc rate is really good.
I have crusader on it and i can say that the proc rate is very similar, almost 1 one proc a fight (PvE).

It stacks with flurry so if it procs with flurry you will get 50% haste on both your weapons, really good.

Comment by Allakhazam

lost this babe today :( ..the other guy who needed rolled 21..i rolled 10 >( focking $%^& WoW !

Comment by Allakhazam

instead of whining about the 1.8 nerf howabout looking at what wasnt nerfed... hemo... i get consistant 800-900 hemo crits on leather and avg 600-700 on plate... pvp rogue mace imo.

Comment by Allakhazam

Proc rate?

Comment by Allakhazam

this isn't a rogue drop, it's main hand, a rogue can obviously use it, but not made specifically for them.

Comment by Allakhazam

We actually got 2 of this hammer in one drop. Both went to rogues. Cept me of course :P

*saving DKP for Perditions* :D

Comment by Allakhazam

1002 SS crit with a 137 top-end dmg dagger, hmmm.... i think i smell bull$%^&

Comment by Allakhazam

Got this mace last week, i'm a arms/fury warrior and i'm really happy to have this beauty when i'm tanking in molten core.

Not exactly the best def stance weapon, but it's really good when it procs and i can spam heroic strike.

Comment by Allakhazam

Anyone can tell us the procrate please? thanks.

Comment by Allakhazam

pos mace.

Comment by Allakhazam

Ahem isn't a rogue drop? Lemme give you an idea for instance my case; Blade Fury adds 20% attack speed (and hits a target nect to you) slice and dice adds 30% attack speed this can add 20 more combine all 3 of these with the highest mainhand ss damage and you and the guy standing next to you are pretty well dead. Sinister strike is based on your main hand maximum damage thus making this very ideal for a rogue. I am sure warriors and shamans and paladins would like it aswell, but this is definetly a damn good option for rogues. My SS crit could be over 1000 with this maybe on cloth.
There is no weapon made specifically for one class hardly and if it was it would have that requirement in order for you to use it.

Edited, Tue Mar 29 22:05:39 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

got it last night off kazzak. i'd post a screenshot but my server is down :(

Richter 60 Rogue, Burning Blade

Edited, Tue Mar 29 22:24:23 2005

Comment by Allakhazam

actually since the patch ive actually crit about 10-20% higher than i did before teh patch i hit a 2234 evis crit at lvl 56 and a 2087 crit against an armored guard inside UBRS in which they absorb butloads of dmg. and i was useing thrash blade and ive even told the rogue class leader in my guild he is halucenating cuz if u ask me its dagger rogues who were nerfed from my experiance my ave evis crit went from 1100-1200 prepatch to about 1300-1500 post patch. In all honesty i realy do not see this nerf actually i think rogues were made into gods in that patch.

Comment by Allakhazam

Id say that this is still the best MH mace in the game for a mace rogue b/c of the proc. If u could get your hands on Anubisath Warhammer u would have the best combo ouside of pvp reward mace that is. When the Empyrean procs both weapons speed up that will produce more mace stuns and more dps. This is prob the 2nd best proc in the game right behind the felstriker.

and i am talking about pvp not pve

Edited, Tue May 9 15:20:56 2006

Comment by Ardensus

I would love to know the procc rate on this if anyone has gotten their hands on it.

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Empyrean Demolisher

Item Level 66
Binds when picked up

Main Hand	Mace

94 - 175 Damage	Speed 2.80

(48.04 damage per second)
Durability 105 / 105

Requires Level 60
Chance on hit: Increases your attack speed by 20% for 10 sec.

Sell Price: 9 5 58

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